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I was wondering the same, Warren. So, I placed a call to the number listed on the marquee. It seems the theater is pretty much in the same shape as it was the day it ran its final screenings. The gentlemen I spoke with mentioned that “somebody did a half-ass job of triplexing the place” but that the cost would be insignificant to have the partitions removed. He also mentioned that the stage would have to be extended to accomodate live shows because at some point the stage was cut, but that there were still dressing rooms and fly space. I assume he meant that it was cut downstage to accommodate a movie screen. He gave me the seating capacity as 1100, which is a far cry from the 1735 listed above. Perhaps he was speaking only of the orchestra seating? The rent, in case we’re all interested in pooling our funds to run our own movie theater, would be $1.5 million per year “to start.” There are no plans to demolish or gut the theater at this time and a deal could be struck for a long term lease of 10 to 15 years, but no more than that.
I wonder how serious I’d have to prove myself to get a glimpse of the interior (and some photographs, naturally)?
I looked up “Phantom of the Opera” on imdb.com, which lists an initial release date of August 27th, 1943. Would the day have been as dark at 6:40 whether am or pm in late August early September? Did they set clocks back and forth for Daylight Savings at this time? Maybe the dates on imdb are wrong. Unless this was a 2nd run… “Phantom” was a Universal Pictures release – did their product generally run on the Loew’s circuit? And a Blondie flick on the same bill?
Isn’t this a wonderful country where such minutia can be dissected and debated? In any event… another wonderful photo, Warren. Thanks!
Jack McCarthy… of course. Good point about the lobby, PKoch. Of course, better still that the whole building be preserved and used as originally intended, but those days are gone. While a few of these magnificent showplaces might have been successfully saved and returned to theatrical use – or at least public space – the days are long gone when one can expect every abandoned 2800 seat theater be restored to former glory. Particularly those situated in residential neighborhoods. If there is no church in need of a space that large, what else can be done with such a structure, unless it is in a viable “downtown” area? This City has already pounded into dust all the viable old palaces it had in the Times Square and mid-town area. Those that remain on the fringes that are not already occupied and cared for by one church or another (Loew’s Valencia, Regent, Loew’s 175th Street, etc) hang on thin threads of hope. So far, the Loew’s Paradise in The Bronx seems to be the only one to break from that paradigm. Only time will tell what kind of a run the Paradise will have in the 21st Century. My fingers are crossed.
I remember watching Officer Joe Bolton on Channel 11 when I was a boy. And who was it that hosted Popeye on WNEW, Eugene McCarthy? I remember years later he was the Grand Marshall of the St. Patrick’s Day Parade on 5th Avenue. Does anyone remember the episode of The Honeymooners where Ralph and Norton are in the house of a deceased rich dowager who has just left “her fortune” to Ralph… and Norton comments that the place is “even nicer than the lobby at the Loew’s Pitkin!”
What a pity to think that lobby has been gutted for retail space!
God I love that sort of stuff, RobertR! Even the schlock was sold with panache! What’s become of showmanship in the industry?!?
Warren… I was thinking the same thing about the lack of people and cars when your shot was taken! I can understand how with a long exposure people hustling by might have blurred themselves out of the image, but what about car headlight streaks?
Where is everybody?!?
Hmmmm. That’s a shame, Warren. Public access is certainly something to consider. I hope it’s something that is in the AMMI’s future plans. Perhaps they are waiting to amass a sufficient amount of material to warrant some sort of Library? They might consider a partnership with Lincoln Center since they already have facilities – though I know how bad the politics can get sometimes between these kinds of institutions.
Turner Classic Movies just held a week long retrospective of the films of Alfred Hitchcock that included a documentary on the making of “North By Northwest.” There is some brief footage of the film’s World Premier at the United Artists Theater in Chicago, a week or two before the film opened in New York at Radio City Music Hall. The marquee depicted at the top of the page dates from 1958 with a Cinemascope presentation… However, “North by Northwest” was filmed in VistaVision and released the following year. Did they install a VV screen somewhere in between or was the screen already there for some time and used for Cinemascope presentations with some sort of masking?
Just a thought, but it occurs to me that the American Museum of the Moving Image in Astoria Queens might also be interested in ActorGuy’s collection of material on the Paramount. They have a reasonable collection of material on display regarding the theatrical presentation of film over the last century. The collection includes tons of advertising material (programs, magazines, matchbooks, posters, lobby cards, etc.) and scores of photographs from the Loew’s organization. They also have an incredible cutaway scale model of the Roxy Theater on display that will absolutely knock your socks off if you ever make it down to Astoria to visit the Museum. I highly recommend it.
Anyway… they might be very interested in ActorGuy’s documentation.
Well… I must admit, the devestation of New York City never entered my mind as a factor to consider in this matter! Hee hee… My tongue is firmly planted in cheek, Jim. Seriously, you do make some valid points. Does the Theatrical Historical Society offer remote access to its archives so that folks from New York – who may have personal experiences having attended the Paramount and other theaters – might peruse its collection? After all, there is still the matter of local heritage. I’ll leave Warren to defend the merits of the Lincoln Center Library, which, after all, is dedicated to the Performing Arts and would seem to have a narrow enough field of focus to do well by the material. I like your final suggestion that copies of the material be scanned and burned to DVD so that they might be shared across multiple institutions… but I’m not sure ActorGuy is looking to make that kind of investment in the material.
ActorGuy, I have to agree with Warren that the material should remain in New York, but then I am a rather biased native New Yorker. I urge you to contact Warren and consider his suggestion before you take the material elsewhere. The New York Historical Society or even the Musuem of the City of New York come to mind as possible alternatives to Lincoln Center, should they elect to pass on the material.
I love the box at the bottom of that ad offering free admission to “Freedomland” for the first 25 kids to show up at the 9:30am showing. Freedomland was a short lived disaster of an amusement park in The Bronx that celebrated American History. It was demolished in the mid ‘60’s to make way for the sprawling Co-Op City apartment complex. Here is a very cool site about Freedomland (and some World’s Fair content as well): View link
Stan… “Mame” was released in 1974. It played with the Easter show on the Great Stage. I saw it here as well.
By the by… the rooftop observation deck at 30 Rockefeller Center (across 51st street from RCMH) is set to re-open on November 1st after being closed to the public for some 20-odd years. If anyone plans on making it in to NYC for the Holidays, a trip to Radio City should be paired with a trip up to the top of the former RCA building. It offers spectacular views from a comfortably open space. I remember visiting when I was a child and was floored by the views of the Empire State Building and Chrysler Building. Bieng not quite as tall as the more famous deck on the 86th floor of the Empire State, you don’t get the feeling so much as being high above the city but more that you’re skimming the top at eye level with all the other mid-town skyscrapers. You might recall that a portion of the “New York, New York” number in “On the Town” were filmed here (most people outside of NY might assume the shot is of Kelly, Sinatra and Munchin singing atop the Empire State, but they’d be wrong). I’m anxious to have a re-visit myself after all these years.
Bless you, BobT!!! I’ve been trying to figure that out for ages, now. I’ll have to dig around online for more historical info and hopefully some photos, but that’s a personal project apart from the doings at this site. Thanks for the push in the right direction!
Hey folks… I can’t find a good spot on this site to pose this question, but it seems this page gets hit a lot so I’ll give it a shot: There used to be a restaurant in mid-town that was located in a sunken plaza (like the concourses at the McGraw-Hill or Paramount Plaza buildings). The place had an automotive theme where patrons would dine at tables fashioned after varying makes and models of vintage cars. There was one particular room towards the back that was set up like a drive-in theater and all the “cars” faced a screen and you could watch a movie while you ate.
I remember going there with my family when I was maybe 9 or 10 years old and the movie we saw was “Airport” – which would have been 4 or 5 years old at that point and I can recall having already seen the movie on Network Television. In fact, I remember thinking that the version I was seeing was somehow different from the one I’d seen on TV because of it’s widescreen use of split images. This was probably the very first time I remember being aware of the concept of aspect ratios and how certain films were somehow not being presented on TV as they were originally intended.
Anyway… does my description of the restaurant jog any memories? I’ve asked my Mom about it, but she doesn’t really remember the name or location. Unfortunately, my Dad is deceased, so I can’t ask him. BoxOfficeBill… perhaps if you flip through one of your mid-70’s era RCMH programs, you might find an ad for this restaurant? I want to say the name had something to do with Ford or had “Ford” in the name, but I really can’t be certain.
This site could use a forum for questions such as this. Maybe even a “mystery theater” page where folks can post recollections about theaters they’ve been unable to identify and employ the collective memories (and detection skills) of Cinema Treasures members as a useful resource. I’ll have to email Ross or Patrick with the suggestion one of these days.
Going back to Ian’s August 18th… can anyone confirm that original elements of Henry Miller’s Theater will indeed be used in the creation of the new space? One evening a couple of weeks back, I attended an “open house” of the Repertory School of New York (a new dramatic arts High School) with my daughter. The school occupies space a couple of floors above Town Hall across the street from the remains of the Henry Miller. As has been mentioned here before, it is quite an odd site to see a single facade wall standing (well, supported by scaffolding and some sort of reinforcement skeleton) in the middle of the block with absolutely nothing but a big crater all around it.
Was the theater completely gutted for the TAO restaurant? I understand the food there is good, and might be interested in making some dinner plans, with camera on hand, particularly if any of the original decor remains.
As hardbop mentioned back in April, there is confusion regarding this theater and the one that was actually located within the Plaza Hotel on Central Park South. I was confused myself about it. That theater (in the hotel) was called Cinema III and was also turned into a restaurant! Here’s the cinematreasures page: /theaters/6461/
Talking about the trashing of original exteriors, didn’t the Broadway Theater get the same treatment? I remember seeing Les Miserables there in 1988 and the exterior was under scaffolding. I believe the facade was completely modernized (removing all traces of character, taste and architectural merit) to fit in with the new hi-rise that was constructed above and around the theater’s shell. I just took a peak at the Broadway’s page and there is very little information about its architectural style. If anyone has any recollections, please add to the page: /theaters/2250/
I might be attending a performance of the new musical The Color Purple at the Broadway in the coming months so I’ll try to make some mental notes (and see if I can’t grab some photos).
Don’t get me wrong, Vincent… I take issue with it as well. We all probably would have been very sad had the developers kept the Rivoli’s interior but obliterated it’s colonaded facade, but better to have the theater preserved to such a large degree than to have it permanently eradicated from existence as it was. Since most Times Square facades were (or would have been by now) completely obscured by billboards, electronic signage and other forms of over-the-top advertising, I’m quite satisfied to trade off the loss of the original neo-classical limestone facade for the preservation of the Palace’s gorgeously opulent interior appointments.
As for those free programs… were they like the Playbills you get at a Broadway theatrical show? Or like the programs at RCMH? Perhaps towards the end of the roadshow era, not every theater had them. Maybe only the Roxy and RCMH. Perhaps others can elaborate here?
Another great photo, Warren. I guess all things are relative however, huh? You rightly point out how sad it was that such a magnificent showplace be reduced to second-run grind… I’m sure the notion would have sent Flo Ziegfeld into an apoplectic rage, but how many of us would have back that time when Loew’s ran the theater in this manner? “Reduced to subsequent-run movie ‘grinder’” is certainly more palatable than “reduced to rubble” – which describes the sad and unfortunate fate this theater ultimately met.
Going back to Gustavelifting’s post in August… those souvenir booklets were not exclusive to classic “roadshow” engagements. I grew up and started going to movies after the “roadshow” era had ended and can recall being able to purchase souvenir booklets for all sorts of movies even at the local neighborhood twins and quartets. Throughout the 70’s and well into the 80’s I was able to purchase these booklets at the candy counters of theaters like the UA Midway, the Lynbrook, the Meadows, Century’s Green Acres Theater and other cinemas. I have booklets for movies like “Moonraker”, “Rocky 2”, “Hair”, “Raiders of the Lost Ark” and all three original “Star Wars” films.
Free programs are another matter alltogether and were probably restricted to the finest first-run theaters back in the “roadshow” heyday… but those souvenir booklets were definitely available on wide release with good regularity through, say, 1983 or 84 when they seemed to just tail off rather rapidly. I remember when I saw “Apocalypse Now!” at it’s first run engagement at the Ziegfeld, the film was presented without any credits or title sequences at all and, instead, patrons were handed a bi-fold that listed the full film credits. I don’t think “Apocalypse Now!” had an exclusive engagement at the Ziegfeld – at least not for long – but that was the only theater in NYC that presented the film in that way, as far as I can recall. The neighborhood showcases ran a version of the film that included the end titles sequence superimposed against the footage of nepalm explosions that you now see when the movie runs on TV (I assume the DVD presents it the same way).
Anyway, the Palace Theater presents a fine example of how developers were able to take advantage of a classic theater’s air rights yet still be able to build over and around to preserve the complete interior of the theater. The Liberty Theater on 42nd Street is another example, sitting silently within the structure of the recent Hilton Hotel and awaiting completion of renovations for adaptive re-use. Too bad the Rivoli Theater just up the road from the Palace couldn’t have been treated with as much respect. Or the old Strand across Duffy Square… Or the Capitol and Astor or ANY of the old palaces that once proudly anchored Times Square. Not to mention the RKO Keith’s in Flushing.
You think word ever got back to the director of “Dear Brat” that his work had been mutilated by Lewis? I say that as facetiously as one can imagine!
Mike69… I am right there with you, brother. While I haven’t been on the inside of the theater since it was last open in ‘86, I can’t imagine it to be in that much worse shape than, say, the New Amsterdam was in the mid '90’s when Disney took it over for renovations. That theater’s interior was exposed to the elements due to holes in its roof and suffered major water damage, yet it was still somehow salvaged. It’s all about location, timing and opportunity. Flushing is not Times Square and a deal has already been finalized. I fear that there is really nothing else that can be done at this time. But I sure wish more of an effort had been made by the City while it had the chance to protect the entire building.
Even so… had they held out for complete renovation, I wonder how many developers would have been attracted to the site? It probably would have taken some philanthropical intervention to restore the building to theatrical use – a Queens Center for Performing Arts or some sort of adjunct to nearby Town Hall (as had been rumored at some point a few years back)? I wonder if that could have worked in this location… parking is a real problem and the local streets are highly congested. And I’m not sure what kind of support a project like this would have had from the immediate surrounding community.
Still… I feel your pain, mike69. This whole situation is painfully frustrating.
Warren… take a look at my photos from September 6th. Looks like they’ve added a fresh coat of baby blue paint to the roll gates and plywood that seal off the former street level store fronts since then. I still love best the vintage exterior photo you posted on September 26th, which really brings out how handsome the facade of the Keith’s once was. I’d love to find some crisp interior photographs one of these days.
I have some current exterior shots (night and day) posted below. There isn’t much of interest inside the theater to capture on film – at least from a historical perspective. As has been written above, the building was gutted right to the outer brick walls for the multiplexing back in the late 80’s. Only the outer lobby (basically a plain glass enclosed space) remains more or less as it was prior to the gutting. You purchase your tickets at either of two exterior booths located at the front entrance under the marquee. You then proceed into the outer lobby and a ticket taker is stationed at far left of the 2nd set of doors leading into the theater. Once beyond those doors you are in the space where the inner lobby was – which featured a large candy counter at the rear wall and a big L-shaped stair case on the right that ascended to the mezzanine.
Today, you’ll find some coin-operated snack machines, a video game or two and, on the right, at least one small auditorium (I believe this is theater #1). On the left side of this street level lobby, there is a long escalator leading to an upper lobby and 2 or 3 auditoriums on that level (there is a candy counter up there as well – though it never seems to be open). Dead center is a short set of stairs that brings you down to the lower lobby and the remaining 3 auditoriums (#’s 2, 3 and 4, I believe).
The big candy counter is located in the lower lobby on the left and entrances to two mid-sized theaters are on the right. At the rear on this level is the big auditorium (#4) which occupies the space where the front of the original orchestra was located. I try to make sure the movie I want to see (and the particular showing I want to attend) is in this auditorium whenever I go to the Meadows. It has a nice sized screen and high ceiling giving the room a comfortable sense of space. At all costs, I avoid that small street level room, which is cramped with a postage stamp screen, low ceiling and a center aisle arrangement of seats, as I recall.
A problem with the theaters on the upper level is that the ONLY bathrooms in the place are located under the staircase on the lower level, meaning you have to come all the way down the long flight to street level and then down the other flight to the lower lobby and then a few steps down farther still and all the way back again for a mid-movie break. You miss a lot of action in that time!
Anyway… the exterior is largely unaltered from prior to renovations. Even the old balcony fire escapes are still there and in use – they are contained within the cream-colored protrusion at the left end of the building shown in the 2nd photo below. The signage was a bit different in the old days… the “Fresh Meadows” logos above the marquee and on the rear of the building were not there. There used to be big letters (where they green?) on the side of the building facing the Long Island Expressway that read “MEADOWS”:
Forgot to add this additional exterior photo from the small employee parking lot in the rear: