It’s all about the presentation and the product. If the theater renovation is done in a first class way then I believe it is possible. The Ridgewood might not succeed as an art house (it is not the demographic of the area), but if the new owners were to create a first class environment and show the movies that people want to see, then it might have a shot.
I agree that it is not fair to judge the performance of the Ridgewood on the last years of its existence because the theater was just poorly maintained. I myself avoid certain theaters that are closer to me but that I feel are dirty or poorly run (Regal Union Square). But if you provide grade A product in a grade A venue, everything changes.
The Kew Gardens Cinemas expanded into a neighboring dry cleaner to create a 6th screen. This theater is a premier example of a neighborhood house that was successfully multiplexed to create an “arthouse cinema” that, from the commentary on its page, is praised by all who visit. It was outfitted with new comfortabe seating and state of the art sound and, while the auditoriums are not large, they create a great theater experience nonetheless.
Maybe, the owners of the Kew Gardens Cinemas could be enticed to do at the Ridgewood what they did in Kew Gardens!
That is the $64MM question! First, of course, it would take money. The first thing a bank would want to see is a viable business plan and marketing studies that supported a need (or probability of success) for a multiplex in Ridgewood. Times being what they are, geting a loan wouldn’t be easy. But, on the positive side, in bad economic times Americans tend to go the movies more often.
I don’t live in the area, but I hear that the Atlas cinemas are actually quite nice and comfortable. How far is this multiplex from the Ridgewood? Would it truly be able to compete?
As Bway stated, more screens could possibly be carved out of the Ridgewood which would make it more viable though most of the theater interior (except for the foyer and lobby) would be somewhat lost. But perhaps that would be worth it to save not just the facade but the entry and lobby and have that fully restored.
I have to think that the prior owners considered this option, but perhaps they just weren’t credit worthy or didn’t want to take the risk. Who is willing to take that risk today?
I don’t want anyone to misunderstand. I love movie palaces and believe in their preservation, but I also am a realist and my background is in real estate. Preservation and restoration can’t be done on wishes alone. They need government grants, tax credits, volunteers, neighborhood activists, historic preservationists, landmark laws, philanthropists, a viable business plan or any combination thereof.
Sadly, it is difficult for palaces to be restored on movies alone. The only theater that I know of in the metropolitan area that has done so is the Lafayette in Suffern, New York and this is a small town theater that is far from the high land value, high tax situation in the city. The Jersey has managed to thrive through a combination of grants, tax incentives and, most of all, volunteers who are commited to restoring this palace to its former grandeur. Even so, they still host weddings in the foyer to help pay the bills.
The Beacon has just completed a multi-million dollar renovation and its location on New York’s Upper West Side will and its backing by a major corporation will ensure that it will be very successful. The St. George on Staten Island has also done very well as a performing arts center. There is no doubt in my mind that The Paradise in the Bronx will eventually do very well once it is taken away from its crooked owners.
Unfortunately, the Jersey, Beacon and St. George have an architectural pedigree that the Ridgewood simply does not. That is what makes saving the Ridgewood so hard. It is readily apparent by the fact that the only piece of the Ridgewood up for Landmark designation is the facade; not the interior.
The Loews Kings sits as a beautiful decaying ruin just a few miles away. If any theater deserves to be converted to a Performing Arts Center it is the Kings. The fact the the Kings, which has so much more going for it, has had so much trouble getting off the ground doesn’t bode well for the Ridgewood.
It’s not enough to say that Ridgewood “deserves” an operating cinema in the area and then dismiss the Atlas cinemas. Times have changed. In all of Staten Island (a borough of almost half a million people, there are but three theaters (all multiplexes). The Bronx and Brooklyn have equally dismal numbers.
If Ridgewood could support a multiplex it would have one. The Ridgewood held on for many years until it could go on no longer. From what I understand, the Ridgewood was quite dingy and couldn’t compete with the much newer theaters with comfortable stadium seating and superior sound systems. So, as hard as it is to hear, Ridgewood, the neighborhood, is no more deserving of a movie theater than any of the other neighborhoods in the city which have lost their beloved palaces over the years.
The best example of what can be done with a neighborhood palace is the St George Theater in Staten Island. This Spanish Baroque beauty was purchased by a family who loved Staten Island in general and this theater in particular and wanted to restore it as a labor of love. But they also wanted it to make money and so they have positioned it as a performing arts center and it has done very well. I have taken the ferry myself to see Joy Behar perform and expect to see the B-52s there later this year.
Movies are not going to save the Ridgewood anymore than they have saved any of the other palaces in the metro area with the sole exception of Loews Jersey and there is no comparison between the grandeur of Loews Jersey (one of the 5 Wonder Theaters) and the Ridgewood.
Yes, Lost Memory….There is absolutely more to this story. I think only Michael Perlman will be able to clarify this as he apparently brought the Ridgewood to the Alabaman’s attention.
One thing I am sure off: This theater is not going to be moved anywhere! If someone wants to move a theater let’s move the Loews Kings, not this plain jane theater. I believe this is a big publicity stunt.
Agreed Panzer. This is a stunt, though she said nothing about moving the actual building. I really don’t see anything viable about her statements. That’s why I am looking forward to a posting by Michael Perlman. He must know more about their intentions than was mentioned in the article.
Another thought. If people are willing to let pieces of the Ridgewood be sold off piece meal than it might as well be made a retail space. At least then, the theater’s limited ornamentation can be restored so that people can see it as it once was in its original space. Better that than have pieces off it sit forlornly in some godforesaken place on the outskits of Birmingham.
MPol, the Cheyenne Diner is arguably much better known in New York City than the Ridgewood Theatre. The Moondance, without a doubt was much better known. I just don’t understand how moving the seats and “some furnishings” of the Ridgewood can be deemed as saving it for future generations to enjoy. Seats, by and large, are not that special and I can’t imagine what else they would relocate to Birmingham and in what capacity. Is there a theater shell in Birmingham that would be “outfitted” with Ridgewood “furinishings”?
This just sounds more like a publicity stunt to me. Especially since Ms. Miller’s stated occupation is “Publicity Manager”. Hmmmmmm……
I have attached excerpts from the NY Times story below so that CT readers can reach their own conclusions.
Hey, Alabama, you want a piece of us?
By Nicole Bengiveno/The New York Times
The Moondance Diner, which sat near the Holland Tunnel, was sold in 2007 and now resides in La Barge, Wyo.
Now that an Alabama couple have purchased the Cheyenne Diner on Ninth Avenue and 33rd Street, they say they are eyeing the historic Ridgewood Theater in Queens, which played movies from 1916 until it closed last year.
Also on their list of possible acquisitions, she said, is the Ridgewood Theater on Myrtle Avenue, where Queens and Brooklyn meet.
“We might take it,†said Ms. Miller, a publicity manager. Mr. Owens is an auto dealer and financial planner.
The 93-year-old movie house, designed by Thomas W. Lamb, who was considered the king of theater architects, never missed a day of showings until it closed last March, making it the longest-continuously operated cinema in the country, according to the Theater Historical Society of America.
Ms. Miller said that she and Mr. Owens learned of the theater’s uncertain fate from Michael Perlman, a local preservationist who has rallied supporters in efforts to save the theater and recently got the preservation commission to consider designating it for protection. In any case, only the facade would be granted landmark status. Of the 25,000 landmark buildings in New York, only 125 are protected inside as well.
Mr. Perlman, 26, who has a graphic arts business and collects vintage postcards, said that the relocation of the seats and other furnishings of the Ridgewood Theater to Birmingham would be “bittersweet.†But he said, “At least it would allow future generations to cherish it.â€
There is an article in today’s NY Times about a couple from Alabama, who purchased the Cheyenne Diner and are moving it to Birmingham. Apparently, they may also be interested in buying the Ridgewood Theatre. it is implied that they would move the interior, but it is not at all clear what would be done and, more importantly, what there is to move besides the seats.
I looked through the pictures provided above by NativeForestHiller (thanks NFH) but I am still stumped. This theater still strikes me as rather bland and not worthy of interior designation; certainly not when compared to the true New York movie palaces. What on earth would they move to Birmingham and why?
I totally agree that the exterior deserves to be landmarked and it is highly unlikely that that could be carted off to Alabama if it is so designated.
Michael Perlman, who is spearheading the effort to save the Ridgewood is quoted in the article but precious few details are disclosed. Hopefully, he will post details on this page.
Hi Anniegirl, I don’t believe Peter K meant that Williamsburg had shantytowns. I assume he was referring to the shantytowns that did exist in many parts of the city during the depression. As a matter of fact, some bums were actually living in makeshift housing in Thompkins Square Park in Manhattan in the 80’s.
Even though it looks like we’re heading into some desperate times, I still don’t think we will ever see the return of shantytowns to our city.
Thanks LM……In the photo, on the right side is “Weisbecker Markets”. It looks like a marquee from a theater. Was this a theater that had already been closed and converted to retail by 1935?
Agreed! However, the new York of today is quite different from the New York of the 70’s, 80’s and early 90’s. Many neighborhoods that were devastated have not only recovered but many have thrived. Neighborhoods like Park Slope, the South Bronx, the Upper West Side above 86th Street, the Lower East Side, Chinatown, Hells Kitchen, Williamsburg, etc have seen incredible recovery, growth and betterment in the quality of life for its residents. Others neighborhoods, like Bed Stuy, Bushwick and East New York are noticeably better. At the same time, brand new neighborhoods have developed like the Financial District, Dumbo, Hudson Square and Long Island City. As long as the city keeps crime under control and keeps people “wanting” to live in our great city, we will not return to those awful days of our city’s past. I believe our current mayor will see to that.
Not if you see what they built on the old parking lot of the RKO Keiths Richmond Hill or the site of the old Loews Triboro in Astoria. The Condos that were built are truly hideous and a slap in the face to the neighborhood.
I’m going to preface this by saying that I have never been to the Ridgewood and I am only going by the photos and comments previously posted on this page, but based on that……I feel that there is no “grandeur” to save. It was never designed to be a Mayan Temple, an Italian Courtyard or a Spanish Villa. It was not atmospheric. It didn’t have murals and I don’t even think it has a fancy Chandelier (I could be wrong about that).
That is why this is so difficult. Many people from outside the neighborhood will say “Why are we saving this? It’s rather plain."
That is why we need the support aof local politicians and people of influence. The designation will happen only with their help. Except for the exterior, the building does not warrant landmark based on its architecture alone.
It is true that each building is its own identity. But identity alone is not enough for landmarking. The primary criteria is Architecture; plain and simple. Other qualifications can be considered, but it is the architecture that is primary. That’s what makes it so difficult to landmark the Ridgewood’s interior. The exterior, in my opinion, is very handsome and deserves designation as of right. But the interior, is bland. It does not have the flourishes of the real palaces and never really did, therefore, there is not much to restore.
Now that I think about it, the Jackson Heights theater (Is it the Jackson?)deserves landmark designation for interior architecture alone from the photos that I have seen.
It is much tougher to get landmark designation for a building simply because it is old or because of the “significance” it has for the neighborhood. It is tougher, but not impossible. John is correct when he says that is why it is imperitive that local leaders get behind the legislation because, in this case, the building does NOT speak for itself.
I also found the comment about Leffert Blvd widening very interesting. Even today, the Q-10 bus has to do a wide turn from Austin Street to be able to turn onto Lefferts. I can see where a wider sidewalk would have been a major problem.
It’s all about the presentation and the product. If the theater renovation is done in a first class way then I believe it is possible. The Ridgewood might not succeed as an art house (it is not the demographic of the area), but if the new owners were to create a first class environment and show the movies that people want to see, then it might have a shot.
I agree that it is not fair to judge the performance of the Ridgewood on the last years of its existence because the theater was just poorly maintained. I myself avoid certain theaters that are closer to me but that I feel are dirty or poorly run (Regal Union Square). But if you provide grade A product in a grade A venue, everything changes.
The Kew Gardens Cinemas expanded into a neighboring dry cleaner to create a 6th screen. This theater is a premier example of a neighborhood house that was successfully multiplexed to create an “arthouse cinema” that, from the commentary on its page, is praised by all who visit. It was outfitted with new comfortabe seating and state of the art sound and, while the auditoriums are not large, they create a great theater experience nonetheless.
Maybe, the owners of the Kew Gardens Cinemas could be enticed to do at the Ridgewood what they did in Kew Gardens!
That is the $64MM question! First, of course, it would take money. The first thing a bank would want to see is a viable business plan and marketing studies that supported a need (or probability of success) for a multiplex in Ridgewood. Times being what they are, geting a loan wouldn’t be easy. But, on the positive side, in bad economic times Americans tend to go the movies more often.
I don’t live in the area, but I hear that the Atlas cinemas are actually quite nice and comfortable. How far is this multiplex from the Ridgewood? Would it truly be able to compete?
As Bway stated, more screens could possibly be carved out of the Ridgewood which would make it more viable though most of the theater interior (except for the foyer and lobby) would be somewhat lost. But perhaps that would be worth it to save not just the facade but the entry and lobby and have that fully restored.
I have to think that the prior owners considered this option, but perhaps they just weren’t credit worthy or didn’t want to take the risk. Who is willing to take that risk today?
I don’t want anyone to misunderstand. I love movie palaces and believe in their preservation, but I also am a realist and my background is in real estate. Preservation and restoration can’t be done on wishes alone. They need government grants, tax credits, volunteers, neighborhood activists, historic preservationists, landmark laws, philanthropists, a viable business plan or any combination thereof.
Sadly, it is difficult for palaces to be restored on movies alone. The only theater that I know of in the metropolitan area that has done so is the Lafayette in Suffern, New York and this is a small town theater that is far from the high land value, high tax situation in the city. The Jersey has managed to thrive through a combination of grants, tax incentives and, most of all, volunteers who are commited to restoring this palace to its former grandeur. Even so, they still host weddings in the foyer to help pay the bills.
The Beacon has just completed a multi-million dollar renovation and its location on New York’s Upper West Side will and its backing by a major corporation will ensure that it will be very successful. The St. George on Staten Island has also done very well as a performing arts center. There is no doubt in my mind that The Paradise in the Bronx will eventually do very well once it is taken away from its crooked owners.
Unfortunately, the Jersey, Beacon and St. George have an architectural pedigree that the Ridgewood simply does not. That is what makes saving the Ridgewood so hard. It is readily apparent by the fact that the only piece of the Ridgewood up for Landmark designation is the facade; not the interior.
The Loews Kings sits as a beautiful decaying ruin just a few miles away. If any theater deserves to be converted to a Performing Arts Center it is the Kings. The fact the the Kings, which has so much more going for it, has had so much trouble getting off the ground doesn’t bode well for the Ridgewood.
It’s not enough to say that Ridgewood “deserves” an operating cinema in the area and then dismiss the Atlas cinemas. Times have changed. In all of Staten Island (a borough of almost half a million people, there are but three theaters (all multiplexes). The Bronx and Brooklyn have equally dismal numbers.
If Ridgewood could support a multiplex it would have one. The Ridgewood held on for many years until it could go on no longer. From what I understand, the Ridgewood was quite dingy and couldn’t compete with the much newer theaters with comfortable stadium seating and superior sound systems. So, as hard as it is to hear, Ridgewood, the neighborhood, is no more deserving of a movie theater than any of the other neighborhoods in the city which have lost their beloved palaces over the years.
The best example of what can be done with a neighborhood palace is the St George Theater in Staten Island. This Spanish Baroque beauty was purchased by a family who loved Staten Island in general and this theater in particular and wanted to restore it as a labor of love. But they also wanted it to make money and so they have positioned it as a performing arts center and it has done very well. I have taken the ferry myself to see Joy Behar perform and expect to see the B-52s there later this year.
Movies are not going to save the Ridgewood anymore than they have saved any of the other palaces in the metro area with the sole exception of Loews Jersey and there is no comparison between the grandeur of Loews Jersey (one of the 5 Wonder Theaters) and the Ridgewood.
Nothing that a church does surprises me anymore!
Per Lost Memory’s prior post, the # of seats to this theater should be updated to reflect 1,432 seats. Current Use: Church
and a rather hideous looking one at that!!!!
Yes, Lost Memory….There is absolutely more to this story. I think only Michael Perlman will be able to clarify this as he apparently brought the Ridgewood to the Alabaman’s attention.
One thing I am sure off: This theater is not going to be moved anywhere! If someone wants to move a theater let’s move the Loews Kings, not this plain jane theater. I believe this is a big publicity stunt.
No one is moving the theater!
Agreed Panzer. This is a stunt, though she said nothing about moving the actual building. I really don’t see anything viable about her statements. That’s why I am looking forward to a posting by Michael Perlman. He must know more about their intentions than was mentioned in the article.
Another thought. If people are willing to let pieces of the Ridgewood be sold off piece meal than it might as well be made a retail space. At least then, the theater’s limited ornamentation can be restored so that people can see it as it once was in its original space. Better that than have pieces off it sit forlornly in some godforesaken place on the outskits of Birmingham.
MPol, the Cheyenne Diner is arguably much better known in New York City than the Ridgewood Theatre. The Moondance, without a doubt was much better known. I just don’t understand how moving the seats and “some furnishings” of the Ridgewood can be deemed as saving it for future generations to enjoy. Seats, by and large, are not that special and I can’t imagine what else they would relocate to Birmingham and in what capacity. Is there a theater shell in Birmingham that would be “outfitted” with Ridgewood “furinishings”?
This just sounds more like a publicity stunt to me. Especially since Ms. Miller’s stated occupation is “Publicity Manager”. Hmmmmmm……
I have attached excerpts from the NY Times story below so that CT readers can reach their own conclusions.
Hey, Alabama, you want a piece of us?
By Nicole Bengiveno/The New York Times
The Moondance Diner, which sat near the Holland Tunnel, was sold in 2007 and now resides in La Barge, Wyo.
Now that an Alabama couple have purchased the Cheyenne Diner on Ninth Avenue and 33rd Street, they say they are eyeing the historic Ridgewood Theater in Queens, which played movies from 1916 until it closed last year.
Also on their list of possible acquisitions, she said, is the Ridgewood Theater on Myrtle Avenue, where Queens and Brooklyn meet.
“We might take it,†said Ms. Miller, a publicity manager. Mr. Owens is an auto dealer and financial planner.
The 93-year-old movie house, designed by Thomas W. Lamb, who was considered the king of theater architects, never missed a day of showings until it closed last March, making it the longest-continuously operated cinema in the country, according to the Theater Historical Society of America.
Ms. Miller said that she and Mr. Owens learned of the theater’s uncertain fate from Michael Perlman, a local preservationist who has rallied supporters in efforts to save the theater and recently got the preservation commission to consider designating it for protection. In any case, only the facade would be granted landmark status. Of the 25,000 landmark buildings in New York, only 125 are protected inside as well.
Mr. Perlman, 26, who has a graphic arts business and collects vintage postcards, said that the relocation of the seats and other furnishings of the Ridgewood Theater to Birmingham would be “bittersweet.†But he said, “At least it would allow future generations to cherish it.â€
There is an article in today’s NY Times about a couple from Alabama, who purchased the Cheyenne Diner and are moving it to Birmingham. Apparently, they may also be interested in buying the Ridgewood Theatre. it is implied that they would move the interior, but it is not at all clear what would be done and, more importantly, what there is to move besides the seats.
I looked through the pictures provided above by NativeForestHiller (thanks NFH) but I am still stumped. This theater still strikes me as rather bland and not worthy of interior designation; certainly not when compared to the true New York movie palaces. What on earth would they move to Birmingham and why?
I totally agree that the exterior deserves to be landmarked and it is highly unlikely that that could be carted off to Alabama if it is so designated.
Michael Perlman, who is spearheading the effort to save the Ridgewood is quoted in the article but precious few details are disclosed. Hopefully, he will post details on this page.
Hi Anniegirl, I don’t believe Peter K meant that Williamsburg had shantytowns. I assume he was referring to the shantytowns that did exist in many parts of the city during the depression. As a matter of fact, some bums were actually living in makeshift housing in Thompkins Square Park in Manhattan in the 80’s.
Even though it looks like we’re heading into some desperate times, I still don’t think we will ever see the return of shantytowns to our city.
Thanks LM……In the photo, on the right side is “Weisbecker Markets”. It looks like a marquee from a theater. Was this a theater that had already been closed and converted to retail by 1935?
We may not be immune to shooting galleries but I do believe we are for Shantytowns. There is no way the city or the public would tolerate it.
Agreed! However, the new York of today is quite different from the New York of the 70’s, 80’s and early 90’s. Many neighborhoods that were devastated have not only recovered but many have thrived. Neighborhoods like Park Slope, the South Bronx, the Upper West Side above 86th Street, the Lower East Side, Chinatown, Hells Kitchen, Williamsburg, etc have seen incredible recovery, growth and betterment in the quality of life for its residents. Others neighborhoods, like Bed Stuy, Bushwick and East New York are noticeably better. At the same time, brand new neighborhoods have developed like the Financial District, Dumbo, Hudson Square and Long Island City. As long as the city keeps crime under control and keeps people “wanting” to live in our great city, we will not return to those awful days of our city’s past. I believe our current mayor will see to that.
um….that wasn’t one of the choices.
Not if you see what they built on the old parking lot of the RKO Keiths Richmond Hill or the site of the old Loews Triboro in Astoria. The Condos that were built are truly hideous and a slap in the face to the neighborhood.
:–)
There’s no bums in front of it!
I’m going to preface this by saying that I have never been to the Ridgewood and I am only going by the photos and comments previously posted on this page, but based on that……I feel that there is no “grandeur” to save. It was never designed to be a Mayan Temple, an Italian Courtyard or a Spanish Villa. It was not atmospheric. It didn’t have murals and I don’t even think it has a fancy Chandelier (I could be wrong about that).
That is why this is so difficult. Many people from outside the neighborhood will say “Why are we saving this? It’s rather plain."
That is why we need the support aof local politicians and people of influence. The designation will happen only with their help. Except for the exterior, the building does not warrant landmark based on its architecture alone.
It is true that each building is its own identity. But identity alone is not enough for landmarking. The primary criteria is Architecture; plain and simple. Other qualifications can be considered, but it is the architecture that is primary. That’s what makes it so difficult to landmark the Ridgewood’s interior. The exterior, in my opinion, is very handsome and deserves designation as of right. But the interior, is bland. It does not have the flourishes of the real palaces and never really did, therefore, there is not much to restore.
Now that I think about it, the Jackson Heights theater (Is it the Jackson?)deserves landmark designation for interior architecture alone from the photos that I have seen.
It is much tougher to get landmark designation for a building simply because it is old or because of the “significance” it has for the neighborhood. It is tougher, but not impossible. John is correct when he says that is why it is imperitive that local leaders get behind the legislation because, in this case, the building does NOT speak for itself.
Agreed John! p.s. I signed the petition! :–)
p.s. I just posted some new observations about the RKO Keiths Richmond Hill.
I also found the comment about Leffert Blvd widening very interesting. Even today, the Q-10 bus has to do a wide turn from Austin Street to be able to turn onto Lefferts. I can see where a wider sidewalk would have been a major problem.