EdSolero, As I ponder what you have written I must say I hope you are right. In addition to the demands for live music from the theatre going public, the producers themselves would propably not be so inclined as to allow canned music. This is why it is so important not to allow what is going on at RCMH to continue, so that the new blood of producers present and future will never be tempted to change the way we see, and more importantly hear, live theatre. Once we begin to slide back and allow what is going on at RCMH to continue, it will spread, and sophisticated and demanding as Broadway audiences are, I worry they will begin to shrug their shoulders and begin to accept and get used to it. Then, there will be no turning back.
Now I’m not trying to be a chicken little here but as impossible as it may seem today, I am not so sure that in the future, if push comes to shove, as unspeakable as it may seem today, the absence of a live orchestra will not stop people from attending musical plays.
Vincent, much of what you say is sad but true. One of the biggest discussions at ShowEast was patrons unruly behavier, MPAA president Dan Glickman adressed the many ways theare owners must work to combat this problem, along with piracy, another big problem for the industry. I read the Daily news article, however it won’t hurt ticket sales, what I don’t understand is why the strike continues.
Actors' Equity Association had asked its members to support musicians striking the Radio City Music Hall’s Christmas Spectacular by joining a muscians picket line Friday. Equity members showed up in solidarity for the 2 pm appointment, but the American Federation of Musicians, Local 802 had decided not to picket. Later, the musicians chose to don tuxedos and spend the evening across the street from Radio City, playing for the public. Equity was hoping to get members to support that effort.
Equity and Local 802 joined forces in 2003 when the musicians' strike shut down Broadway. Although Equity had a “no-strike” clause in its contract with producers-meaning a union will not strike to support another union’s walkout-Equity used the stagehands' striking in support of Local 802 as its rationale for not performing. Actors would not work in conditions made unsafe by the absence of stagehands, Equity contended. Actors then joined the picket lines. The strike lasted four days before musicians and producers came to terms on a new pact. The Rockettes need to put those beautifull legs to better use on a picket line in solidarity with the rest of the behind the scenes workforce at RCMH. End this madness now!
Well said ERD, we have only our memories and photographs of a wonderful time. I was there, trouble is I did not appreciate how magnificent it all was at the time. I never expected to lose it all, but we did. I was working for UA when the Rivoli was carved into three theatres, I worked on the projection installation. It was then I realised things were changing fast and not, in my opinion, in a good way.
What is going on? where is the outrage?, were are the picket lines?,
have the musicians decided to roll over and play dead?
This would not have been the case in my day, please tell me the entire run will be without the musicians. If RCMH management gets away with this, it be the beginning of the end for live music on Broadway. If the big bad Music Hall can do the biggest live show of the year with canned music, and get away with it, because no one seems to care or as it has been written on this website, “it’s all the same”, what hope will there be for the future of live music in any Broadway show. Last week, I went to see a demonstration of the new 3-D Dolby Digital projection, I must say I was very impressed but said at the same time, because I walked out of the theatre thinking, my God I have just witnessed what could be the nail in the coffin for film presentation at the movies. The next generations may never see film, I guess that’s progress but I can’t help feeling very bad about it. I just hope the next generation is not deprived of seeing a Broadway musical without a live orchestra.
Robert, I remember UA ran the Paramount for a while but don’t recall the Lane under that banner. I was woking for UA at the Syosset on Long Island at that time. I hadn’t worked the Lane after 1965 buy I suppose anything is possible.
Vincent, perhaps I was a bit harsh, I hope you were kidding or I mis understood your comment. Surely you don’t believe in or support what RCMH management is doing.
Denapiano and Patsy, what is even more disturbibg is, did you notice that over half the audience members were senior citizens? I can almost forgive the kids, they don’t know any better, but the seniors?, that is disturbing I thought surely they would be on our side. I worry also that management will say, hey look at that we got away with it. That is why we must continue to pressure them, surly the folks wanting live music must out number the ones who do care. I also honestly believe this whole thing will be settled very soon. As of last night no new talks were scheduled, perhaps today that will change. Hang in there Denapiano.
Well the shows did go on. However when musicians president, David Lennon and the rest of the orchestra arrived in good fath to begin work for the 11AM show, they were greeted by security guards and told they were locked out. The guards looked like night club bouncers which made the whole experience more difficult. Mikyl Cordova, spokesman for for the hall, came out and explained the position that untill a signed contract was in place, the musicians were considered on strike and would not be allowed to work. The musicians remained outside the stage door, a couple of them playing Christnas music. The 3PM show was a repeat of the earlier show with musicians not permitted to enter the hall. As the parons exited what looked like a sold out 11AM performance, some said the show was “fantastic” and that they did not mind the pre recorded music while others said they felt cheated and it just was not the same.
Most agreed however, that the show would have been better with the live orchestra. I wish the other unions could have gone out as well, but they all have a no strike clause in their contracts and had to work. My hope is that this will all be settled for tommorrow’s 2PM show, there is no performance tonight. Mayor Bloomberg has asked both sides to get together and come to terms. I hope music hall management will allow all those talented, hard working musicians back to work, they are willing and ready to play even without a contract. Radio City should be ashamed of themselves for locking out the musicians and charging top broadway ticket prices for canned music. Cablevision, shame on you!
UPDATE
I just spoke with a reliable source who told me last night preview show was cancelled, however in spite of the fact that they do not have a contract, have decided to play today in the spirt of the tradition of the Christmas show and for the many people who have tickets to todays performances. Although the first show is 11AM it is unclear wheather or not Radio City will allow them to play or go on with their plan to use canned music. However, in light of the solidarity issue I can’t imagine that will happen.
Congrats to Local 802 for their dedication to the people of New York in the decision to continue to work this problem out and not strike
today. Radio City, the ball in in your court.
Oh Denpiano that’s great! I was hoping for solidarity.
It sounds as if there will be a contract for the musicians by the start of todays show. Please keep us posted, I am going to try and swing by there today.
veyoung, I recall Scorcese speaking about seeing “Vertgo” in VistaVision, he said he saw it in New York and since the Capital did not offer VistaVision projection he may have seen it at the Paramount screening room. He would have seen true VistaVision there although the screen was not all that big. As far as I can recall the only way to see horizontal VistaVision projection in New York was at the Paramount theatre or the Paramount screening room. Radio City installed the projectors but used them only once for “White Christmas”.
Oh the drive-ins were fun, spending the afternoons in the fresh air “walking the field” checking and repairing the speakers.
I’d always have the booth door open welcoming the folks stopping by to see what went on behind the scenes. Of course you never went hungry with all the great hamburgers, hot dogs and pizza you could eat. Much of what they didn’t sell by the end of the night went to the hungry staff. Good times! I also remember the all-weather theatres which had a drive-in on one end and a indoor on the other, with a common booth which had four projectors, two on each side of the room. It got a little hectic when the same movie played on both sides a half hour a part, a reel would run 17-20 minutes and you would have to get it rewind and threaded on the other side in time.
Sometimes we would get a break when they ran the A picure on one side while the B picture was on the other.
Had a similar problem with the bells, we put electrical tape around the bell to muffle it. So what we heard was more of a thud than a bell, seem to work OK, no complaints. I have to admit during one or two of my 14 hour grind shifts I did take the tape off around the 10th hour in case I dozed off. : ))
Also I am not forgiving of management for basically throwing them out of the building on Sunday, I guess no one remembers it was the rockettes who spearheaded the drive to save the theatre when the wrecking ball was about to strike.
Denpiano, unfortunatly you may be right, I am sure the lawyers have checked into other contracts to be sure nanagemant could pull this off without losing the other unions. As for the Rockettes, did they also get the maternity leave they asked for?
Cablevision wants to cut the musicians' pay for Christmas Spectacular. For 75 years, the musicians of Radio City Music Hall have been an irreplaceable part of the Christmas Spectacular tradition. Now, if Cablevision doesn’t get their way, they’ve threatened to shut down the entire show or rip off the public by putting on the show with taped music or amateur players, the Rockettes were escourted by security out of the theatre on Sunday,
I guess they plan on using some high kicking high school girls to take their place. They are even trying to put together a scab (non union)orchestra of musicians affected by the recent hurricane disasters.
Now I am sure many of you will disagree with me here but I must speak my mind. If cablevision continues with this plan of action I would hope the muscians union will picket the theatre and all other unions will respect the musicians and not enter the theatre. Let’s see them try and put on the show without stage hands, projectionists and electricaians. As far as I am concerned, Cablevision can shut the place down, board it up or turn it in to a parking lot for all I care but they cannot be allowed to treat the dedicated people who have made the theatre what it is today in such a disgraceful manner.
Please forgive any typo’s or grammer errors, I am mad as hell.
Thanks Denpiano, That is disturbing news, musicians are artists who deserve proper compensation for their contribution to the music halls success, I wish them well. I am also very disturbed by the lack of respect Cablevision showed towards the Rockettes by having security people escort them out of the theatre on Friday. A bit much wouldn’t you say? Of course there is always two sides to every story, but I would like to know what prompted Cablevision to take such dramatic and drastic measures.
EdSolero, As I ponder what you have written I must say I hope you are right. In addition to the demands for live music from the theatre going public, the producers themselves would propably not be so inclined as to allow canned music. This is why it is so important not to allow what is going on at RCMH to continue, so that the new blood of producers present and future will never be tempted to change the way we see, and more importantly hear, live theatre. Once we begin to slide back and allow what is going on at RCMH to continue, it will spread, and sophisticated and demanding as Broadway audiences are, I worry they will begin to shrug their shoulders and begin to accept and get used to it. Then, there will be no turning back.
Now I’m not trying to be a chicken little here but as impossible as it may seem today, I am not so sure that in the future, if push comes to shove, as unspeakable as it may seem today, the absence of a live orchestra will not stop people from attending musical plays.
Vincent, much of what you say is sad but true. One of the biggest discussions at ShowEast was patrons unruly behavier, MPAA president Dan Glickman adressed the many ways theare owners must work to combat this problem, along with piracy, another big problem for the industry. I read the Daily news article, however it won’t hurt ticket sales, what I don’t understand is why the strike continues.
Actors' Equity Association had asked its members to support musicians striking the Radio City Music Hall’s Christmas Spectacular by joining a muscians picket line Friday. Equity members showed up in solidarity for the 2 pm appointment, but the American Federation of Musicians, Local 802 had decided not to picket. Later, the musicians chose to don tuxedos and spend the evening across the street from Radio City, playing for the public. Equity was hoping to get members to support that effort.
Equity and Local 802 joined forces in 2003 when the musicians' strike shut down Broadway. Although Equity had a “no-strike” clause in its contract with producers-meaning a union will not strike to support another union’s walkout-Equity used the stagehands' striking in support of Local 802 as its rationale for not performing. Actors would not work in conditions made unsafe by the absence of stagehands, Equity contended. Actors then joined the picket lines. The strike lasted four days before musicians and producers came to terms on a new pact. The Rockettes need to put those beautifull legs to better use on a picket line in solidarity with the rest of the behind the scenes workforce at RCMH. End this madness now!
Sorry, I meant to say the theatre was carved into two theatres, it was the Syosset on Long Island that was carved into three shortly there after.
Well said ERD, we have only our memories and photographs of a wonderful time. I was there, trouble is I did not appreciate how magnificent it all was at the time. I never expected to lose it all, but we did. I was working for UA when the Rivoli was carved into three theatres, I worked on the projection installation. It was then I realised things were changing fast and not, in my opinion, in a good way.
Sorry, obviously I meant the last line to read WITH a live orchestra.
What is going on? where is the outrage?, were are the picket lines?,
have the musicians decided to roll over and play dead?
This would not have been the case in my day, please tell me the entire run will be without the musicians. If RCMH management gets away with this, it be the beginning of the end for live music on Broadway. If the big bad Music Hall can do the biggest live show of the year with canned music, and get away with it, because no one seems to care or as it has been written on this website, “it’s all the same”, what hope will there be for the future of live music in any Broadway show. Last week, I went to see a demonstration of the new 3-D Dolby Digital projection, I must say I was very impressed but said at the same time, because I walked out of the theatre thinking, my God I have just witnessed what could be the nail in the coffin for film presentation at the movies. The next generations may never see film, I guess that’s progress but I can’t help feeling very bad about it. I just hope the next generation is not deprived of seeing a Broadway musical without a live orchestra.
Robert, I remember UA ran the Paramount for a while but don’t recall the Lane under that banner. I was woking for UA at the Syosset on Long Island at that time. I hadn’t worked the Lane after 1965 buy I suppose anything is possible.
Vincent, perhaps I was a bit harsh, I hope you were kidding or I mis understood your comment. Surely you don’t believe in or support what RCMH management is doing.
Vincent, Of course I respect you right to your opinion but your remark is so ridiculous it is not even worth a responce.
Denapiano and Patsy, what is even more disturbibg is, did you notice that over half the audience members were senior citizens? I can almost forgive the kids, they don’t know any better, but the seniors?, that is disturbing I thought surely they would be on our side. I worry also that management will say, hey look at that we got away with it. That is why we must continue to pressure them, surly the folks wanting live music must out number the ones who do care. I also honestly believe this whole thing will be settled very soon. As of last night no new talks were scheduled, perhaps today that will change. Hang in there Denapiano.
Thanks Patsy, for the informative post.
Well the shows did go on. However when musicians president, David Lennon and the rest of the orchestra arrived in good fath to begin work for the 11AM show, they were greeted by security guards and told they were locked out. The guards looked like night club bouncers which made the whole experience more difficult. Mikyl Cordova, spokesman for for the hall, came out and explained the position that untill a signed contract was in place, the musicians were considered on strike and would not be allowed to work. The musicians remained outside the stage door, a couple of them playing Christnas music. The 3PM show was a repeat of the earlier show with musicians not permitted to enter the hall. As the parons exited what looked like a sold out 11AM performance, some said the show was “fantastic” and that they did not mind the pre recorded music while others said they felt cheated and it just was not the same.
Most agreed however, that the show would have been better with the live orchestra. I wish the other unions could have gone out as well, but they all have a no strike clause in their contracts and had to work. My hope is that this will all be settled for tommorrow’s 2PM show, there is no performance tonight. Mayor Bloomberg has asked both sides to get together and come to terms. I hope music hall management will allow all those talented, hard working musicians back to work, they are willing and ready to play even without a contract. Radio City should be ashamed of themselves for locking out the musicians and charging top broadway ticket prices for canned music. Cablevision, shame on you!
UPDATE
I just spoke with a reliable source who told me last night preview show was cancelled, however in spite of the fact that they do not have a contract, have decided to play today in the spirt of the tradition of the Christmas show and for the many people who have tickets to todays performances. Although the first show is 11AM it is unclear wheather or not Radio City will allow them to play or go on with their plan to use canned music. However, in light of the solidarity issue I can’t imagine that will happen.
Congrats to Local 802 for their dedication to the people of New York in the decision to continue to work this problem out and not strike
today. Radio City, the ball in in your court.
Oh Denpiano that’s great! I was hoping for solidarity.
It sounds as if there will be a contract for the musicians by the start of todays show. Please keep us posted, I am going to try and swing by there today.
Ohhh Warren the thought of that material has you salavating :)
Don’t Let Cablevision $teal Christmas!
SUPPORT RADIO CITY MUSICIANS!
Call CEO Jim Dolan at
(516) 803-1002.
Tell him you demand the real Radio City orchestra, not canned music
Thanks Gerald, neither Scorsese or Scorcese saw Vertigo projected in VistaVision at the Capital. :)
veyoung, I recall Scorcese speaking about seeing “Vertgo” in VistaVision, he said he saw it in New York and since the Capital did not offer VistaVision projection he may have seen it at the Paramount screening room. He would have seen true VistaVision there although the screen was not all that big. As far as I can recall the only way to see horizontal VistaVision projection in New York was at the Paramount theatre or the Paramount screening room. Radio City installed the projectors but used them only once for “White Christmas”.
Oh the drive-ins were fun, spending the afternoons in the fresh air “walking the field” checking and repairing the speakers.
I’d always have the booth door open welcoming the folks stopping by to see what went on behind the scenes. Of course you never went hungry with all the great hamburgers, hot dogs and pizza you could eat. Much of what they didn’t sell by the end of the night went to the hungry staff. Good times! I also remember the all-weather theatres which had a drive-in on one end and a indoor on the other, with a common booth which had four projectors, two on each side of the room. It got a little hectic when the same movie played on both sides a half hour a part, a reel would run 17-20 minutes and you would have to get it rewind and threaded on the other side in time.
Sometimes we would get a break when they ran the A picure on one side while the B picture was on the other.
I can only hope there will be solidarity with all the unions and they shut down the show. Local 802 will hold a rally today at 5pm
Had a similar problem with the bells, we put electrical tape around the bell to muffle it. So what we heard was more of a thud than a bell, seem to work OK, no complaints. I have to admit during one or two of my 14 hour grind shifts I did take the tape off around the 10th hour in case I dozed off. : ))
Also I am not forgiving of management for basically throwing them out of the building on Sunday, I guess no one remembers it was the rockettes who spearheaded the drive to save the theatre when the wrecking ball was about to strike.
Denpiano, unfortunatly you may be right, I am sure the lawyers have checked into other contracts to be sure nanagemant could pull this off without losing the other unions. As for the Rockettes, did they also get the maternity leave they asked for?
Cablevision wants to cut the musicians' pay for Christmas Spectacular. For 75 years, the musicians of Radio City Music Hall have been an irreplaceable part of the Christmas Spectacular tradition. Now, if Cablevision doesn’t get their way, they’ve threatened to shut down the entire show or rip off the public by putting on the show with taped music or amateur players, the Rockettes were escourted by security out of the theatre on Sunday,
I guess they plan on using some high kicking high school girls to take their place. They are even trying to put together a scab (non union)orchestra of musicians affected by the recent hurricane disasters.
Now I am sure many of you will disagree with me here but I must speak my mind. If cablevision continues with this plan of action I would hope the muscians union will picket the theatre and all other unions will respect the musicians and not enter the theatre. Let’s see them try and put on the show without stage hands, projectionists and electricaians. As far as I am concerned, Cablevision can shut the place down, board it up or turn it in to a parking lot for all I care but they cannot be allowed to treat the dedicated people who have made the theatre what it is today in such a disgraceful manner.
Please forgive any typo’s or grammer errors, I am mad as hell.
Thanks Denpiano, That is disturbing news, musicians are artists who deserve proper compensation for their contribution to the music halls success, I wish them well. I am also very disturbed by the lack of respect Cablevision showed towards the Rockettes by having security people escort them out of the theatre on Friday. A bit much wouldn’t you say? Of course there is always two sides to every story, but I would like to know what prompted Cablevision to take such dramatic and drastic measures.