Ziegfeld Theatre
141 W. 54th Street,
New York,
NY
10019
141 W. 54th Street,
New York,
NY
10019
131 people
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With respect to scope/trailers
When trailers are shipped to theatres it is almost always in both scope and flat versions.
Almost all flat features have trailers available in both scope and flat formats, as well as scope features which have trailers available in a flat version. In addition, all features have at least one trailer of an up coming movie attached to the head of reel one, with an additional 2-3 others trailers enclosed in the film can. Although deals are made within the studio system to play one another’s trailers. The film buyer (booker) may also negotiate trailer and posters when the film is booked. Studios will often send checkers to the theatres to verify the trailers being shown are correct. A report is later sent to the theatre owners home office and any inconsistencies are taken up with the theatre in question and corrections must be made.
What you are seeing when what appears to be a flat trailer is actually the anamorphic version, but it is true to the flat ratio, therefore you will see a black boarder on each side of the image. Occasionally this is done letterbox style with black boarders at the top and bottom with the image across the entire scope screen. This allows the theatre to show the complete program, trailers and feature, though the same lens, eliminating the need for several lens/masking changes in the program. The same procedure is used for movies filmed flat with scope versions of the trailer which are available to show with a flat feature.
As to the masking, when showing a flat trailer through an anamorphic lens it is of course possible to bring the masking in to properly mask the image, don’t hold our breath, I know no one who actually goes to the trouble of doing that. The Ziegfeld should absolutely do it, but, well …you know.
I hope this helps explain the black boarders on the trailer showings, let me know if you have any other questions or if I did not make my self clear.
Veyoung, I was thinking the same thing… But this was an all-digital presentation at the Ziegfeld on Saturday (indeed, throughout this engagement). I wonder if the order of the trailers is hard coded in the download… or can they be manipulated by the projectionist?
“What to do if you have a series of trailers of varying aspect ratios?"
This has always annoyed the stuffing out of me. Is it just laziness or lack of time that would prevent the operator from assembling the trailers (reassembling if they come from the lab already in a certain order regardless of ratio) with all the "flats” together and then the “scopes”? I know some contracts stipulate which trailers must be shown with a certain feature, but is it anywhere dictated by contract the order in which these trailers are shown?
Of course, this assumes that this same operator would have the sense to show “flat” first with masking closed, then “scope” with masking open, or am I really veering towards delirium?
Thanks, Vito. I singled out NA only because the College Point Multiplex (12 screens) in Queens used to be notorious for incredibly LO-OOOONG wait times at the lobby concession stands. There were usually 2 – 3 people behind the twin counters and the lines could grow very long as showtime approached. Sometimes, on a Friday or Saturday night, they’d open the auxilliary candy counters located in each of the two foyers where the auditorium entrances are located. Even then, on a crowded night the lines at each counter were insufferable. In recent years, they opened a Sbarro’s/Nathan’s counter where they used to have a game room. That helped disburse the crowds somewhat. The situation may have improved since I stopped attending shows there a year or so ago.
In any event, what keeps me from College Point more than anything else are the obnoxious crowds – which is why I pointed out how attentive and well behaved the Ziegfeld crowd was. Most mutliplexes in Queens and Long Island seem to draw the same sort of inconsiderate folks no matter what the nieghborhood – parents of infants and toddlers who don’t let the lack of babysitting help prevent them from their night out at the movies (even if rated a hard “R” for violence & sex) or jerks texting on their cell phones or – worse still – answering calls and holding extended conversations while the feature is in progress.
As for masking… Here’s a potential dilemma that occurred to me, Vito. What to do if you have a series of trailers of varying aspect ratios? Some trailers are flat and some in scope.
And whatever happened to those “Coming Attractions” and “Now our feature presentation” bumpers? Those would make perfect curtain opener fodder if, say, a studio didn’t want their logo to ever be obscured in a presentation.
Of course you may Ed; Let’s try this one more time.
The preshows are here to stay; I have accepted the fact that the revenue brought in by them is too much to give back. Although I question the need for them at the Ziegfeld. It’s just cheapens the whole movie palace experience.
Curtains and masking:
When you have preshow and curtains, the proper thing to do is to close the curtains and raise the stage lights about a minute before the movie is to begin. That would be a nice touch, and would set the stage for the audience to begin anticipation of the movie’s start. After a minute or so the movie should begin with the stage lights dimming and the curtains opening on the first frame of the movie, and not open the curtains to revile a white screen before starting the movie. If there is a flat trailer the masking should of course be at the proper setting to mask the image properly, it should not be left full open. At the end of the flat presentation, a “deluxe†should be performed, which is closing the curtains timed for the two panels to kiss as the last frame fades or ends. Stage lights should be raised at this point as well. At the start of the feature the curtains open and the stage lights dim, careful not to allow the curtains to open to soon which would expose a white screen. If the feature is scope, the masking should be opened before the curtains so that is not seen moving, by the time the curtain is fully open the masking should already be in the scope position. At the end of the movie a complete shut down must be performed, the curtains should close timed properly as not to show white screen. Allow the audience to file out with the curtains in the closed position, they should remain that way until the next audience, who should see the closed curtains as they come into the theatre, come in .Once the initial crowd has gotten in their seats the curtains can be opened to start the preshow. The loss of time when the preshow is not on would be minimal, a small price to pay to allow the audience to experience a bit of class and old-time showmanship.
Is ther any hope for Clearview to pay more attention to this?
You mentioned poor staffing at National Amusements, I wish to let you know that the staffing is determined by an estimated attendance, and is calculated for optimum staff coverage. If you are seeing poor staffing at one of those theatres I encourage you to make it known to management. It is not supposed to be that way, especially in the concession stand where a great deal of care is taken with staffing in order to ensure high PCs (per cap). Theatres are expected to generate a PC of at least $3 dollars) per person) and poor staffing makes that difficult. Of course the problem often comes from misjudgment in the attendance, or no shows and call outs in staffing
I caught the 7pm show last night (Saturday). It was the first time I’ve watched “Blade Runner” from start to finish since I first saw it in theatres back in 1982. Stunning. I was completely drawn in to the film and think it has aged rather well. AlAlvarez… I was definitely in your camp about the original (even if unintended by Scott) voice over narration being a key part in creating the noir atmosphere of the movie, but now that I’ve finally seen the film without it, I think Scott was right to remove it. I much prefer having the images and the accompaniement of Vangelis' fantastic electronic score convey the story and subtexts without having the voice over spell everything out for me. Even without the narration, I think the noir look and ambience is still intact and perhaps even more effective (it occurs to me that narration in a noir homage risks bordering on unintended parody).
Anyway… enough about the movie itself – this page is about the Ziegfeld. The atmosphere at the theatre was great. As we approached the theatre around 6:30pm we could see a number of people milling about the entrance and there was a definite buzz in the ticket lobby as folks waited on line to purchase admissions. Once upstairs, the sense of anticipation was even greater with the upper lobby fairly crowded and the auditorium already starting to fill in. It felt like an opening night! Kudos to Ziegfeld management for properly staffing the theatre for the evening – the candy counter was manned by no less than 5 cashiers (could it have been six?) utilizing every cash register and speedily serving patrons with great efficiency and courtesy. You can’t usually find 5 people manning the concessions at a National Amusements Twelve-plex on a crowded Saturday night!
When we walked into the auditorium the digital pre-show was already underway. We found seats in the center section about a dozen or so rows back and 5 or 6 seats in from the aisle. The sound for the pre-show was very low and practically inaudible over the buzz of the crowd, but I did notice the audio was turned up just a bit towards the end and I thought I noticed the house lights dim and then come back up almost as an announcement to folks that the show was going to start shortly (or maybe just a miscue by the projectionist). Finally, the lights dimmed and the curtains closed as the pre-show was drawing to a close – showing no blank screen to my gratification. However, when the curtains were opened a few moments later, the projectionist waited until the entire blank screen was revealed before running the trailers.
As reported here before, the Ladd Company logo was met with applause and then the theatre remained in absolute silence throughout the rest of the presentation (what a pleasant relief from the usual rude and inattentive multiplex crowds). The image looked great – but I have to say that, even to my untrained eye, the crispness and clarity is still not quite what one would get from a fresh and umblemished 35mm print – let alone 70mm! After the end credits, the curtains were left open – presumably remained that way until after the pre-show leading up to the next showing (10pm). That was a bit disappointing. One other minor gripe – the matte curtains were left open to scope setting throughout the preshow and trailers. Would it have been too much to ask that the masking be brought and not opened until the feature?
I still would like to champion a proper curtain show to start and end the feature as well as proper masking for the preshow and trailers. I hope Craig is reading this. The Ziegfeld is such a special theatre in NYC. Showmanship should be at its very finest here! Last night’s show was fantastic – and nothing can replace the electricity of a large crowd at the Ziegfeld. But why not strive for flawlessness? Mandate proper masking and curtain cues throughout – old school! Can I get an “amen” Vito?
Hi everyone:
Been a long time, I was at the 1 PM “Blade Runner” yesterday. Nice turnout, with a long line present for the next showing. Congrats to the Ziegfeld.(I agree, Bill, I was watching those close-ups also). An absolutely pristine movie going experience. I saw this film on opening day in 1982 and, regardless of the version, it just gets better and better with time.
From the poster, I thought that “Enchanted” might be a remake of “Sleeping Beauty” or “Snow White.” Think again. This one looks like a real hoot with an amazing premise. Can’t wait.
Also, as usual, I will be there Christmas day for “Sweeney Todd.”
Long live the Zieg!!!!
Also, although I’m not hung up on the curtains, they did open and close, and, I agree, it is a very nice touch.
Best,
Gary
Last night’s “Blade Runner” show was fine. No use of the curtains, though. The digital image filled the entire screen and was extremely sharp. You could see the pores in Harrison Ford’s face during close-ups. I saw it in 70mm in 1982 and although it’s a long time gap to make a really accurate comparison, I’d say the image we saw last night was just as good. Could this be the future of screening classic 70mm films, as some people on this site have predicted?
Big crowd last night too. People were searching for seats in the center section. Always good to see something like that at the Ziegfeld.
Upcoming films at the Ziegfeld: “The Nightmare Before Christmas 3D”, “Enchanted” and “Sweeney Todd: The Demon Barber of Fleet Street”. The trailer for that last one was interesting – you never knew it was a musical until the last few seconds of the trailer. I heard they cut more than half the songs out of the show too – we shall see.
Thanks for telling us, Ed. The last photo (stairway ornate metalwork)and the last 2 photos of the auditorium facing curtain & screen are mine. Most if not all the other photos are from others at flickr. None are copywrit so fine to use them. Afterall, each was posted on flickr to share with the world. And, all were taken during Clearview’s operation of the theater. I know I’m honored by their use of the photos. Long live the Ziegfeld! And, Clearview, too. In taking care of the Ziegfeld, and with excellent projection, sound, seats, and a classics program at the Ziegfeld and other theaters, Clearview has established their company as one of the very best movie operators in the United States.
operators in the United States.
Clearview has revised its website and there is now a page of images for the Ziegfeld. Some of the images should look quite familiar to CT members… Looks like that flickr photostream posted above by HowardBHaas caught the eye of someone at Clearview!
“Blade Runner” playing at the Ziegfeld: NYC got it right. Here at LA it’s screening at one of the Landmark theatres. Not to diss Landmark, but it would have been cool to see this at the National, Chinese or the Dome.
Jodar, I agree 100 %: As to why this did not get a Special FX Award (and in my opinion, production design) baffles the imagination.
And as far as Deckard being an android, excuse me a “replicant”, yes, it’s just plain nonsense.
JSA
JodarMovieFan, I have seen the Bee trailer. I will add the AMC Hoffman tomorrow to this website after I doublecheck, because I don’t think it is here. I visit NYC & DC from Philly. For awhile, lived in DC, back when Circle & KB still were movie operators.
ok, let’s hear from others who might want to comment on their favorite Sound trailers at the Ziegfeld.
Its a really cool trailer, Howard. If you’re in the DC area, they will play it at those venues that have the Dolby digital projection system set up such as Bow Tie Annapolis #10, AMC Hoffman, Georgetown and some others. Right now, they’re playing a Dolby trailer that features Jerry Seinfeld’s upcoming movie “Bee.” Come to think of it, that trailer may be more for the sound as opposed to the digital picture. Not 100% sure, maybe its both? I’m not sure which NYC venues have the install.
When I saw Sith here, in ‘05, the Ziegfeld’s sound system came alive with contrasting, yet powerful sound effects such as a water wave, fire and a strong woofer mmmmmmmm as the Dolby Digital Cinema trailer came to an end. Even my cynical friend enjoyed it, which is saying a lot. For me, it was a tingler to experience the color morphing and contrasting sounds.
I still don’t recall it. My favorite was the Train which I recall in Washington D.C. at the Uptown, perhaps with the start of Digital sound, DTS, I think, and for the surround effects as well as the image.
Howard, the Dolby Digital Cinema trailer is the trailer that starts out with a piece of film that burns, then it dissolves into a count down that starts..10-9-8-, etc with a different CGI effect of brilliant, yet contrasting colors until the Dolby Digital Cinema logo comes up. I forget the precise ending but it it says something to the effect of ‘experience for your eyes’ or ‘difference’ or something like that.
I’ve always enjoyed format and sound trailer (i.e. the various THX ones) before the main attraction as it showcases the theater’s sound/picture capability and range. Its analogous to that perfect appetizer that whets your desire and anticipation for that main course.
JordarMovieFan, thanks for your account of your experience!
I’ve only been attending movies at the Ziegfeld for a decade, and don’t recall the Dolby trailer.
Last night, my friend and I attended the 8:30pm show of Blade Runner. I printed several copies of Bill’s Clearview coupon and presented it to the cashier, who looked at it with some puzzlement. I had a fleeting fear that she was going to accuse me of fraudulent coupon manufacturing in spite of my best efforts at tweaking settings on my Phaser color laser printer :) But she took it and discounted our tickets. Thanks, again Bill! We arrived before 8pm to a sparsely filled theater that eventually filled up to probably 75% of capacity by showtime. When the ticket taker took our tickets, I made it a point to him that we drove 235 miles to see this movie in “your magnificent theater” and expect the film to be played loud and to not disappoint us. He smiled and said “don’t worry, it will be played loud.”
The house lights dimmed, the curtain closed and opened and the show began with the Ladd company logo, to the applause of the audience. They forgot to play that wonderful Dolby Digital Cinema 5-4-3-2-1 trailer that I love and remember at this theater.
Oh well. Back to the movie. The restoration effort yielded quite an impressive presentation from the simple but bright white title credits to the excellent visual FX work by Doug Trumbull’s EEG facility. Now tell me why, why on earth that little movie about a caca looking alien WON 1982’s Oscar for Visual FX over this film just boggles my mind. The LA landscape, dark, murky depressing with those Egyptian-inspired superskyscrapers and those cool looking spinner cars!
Not to be nitpicky, but I did notice a ‘hiccup’ or sorts (I’m trying to remember now writing this after having only 2 hrs sleep in the last 30 hrs) in the scene preceding Deckard’s initial encounter with Rachel. It was sustainable enough to notice and at second thought, I thought it may have been an intentional subliminal message :) (Buy more Clearview popcorn and soda maybe?) Towards the end, at the bottom of the screen, I could see some spotting. Probably most will not notice. Perhaps it was the projector and not the transfer, itself.
In the interrogation scene, based on my recollection from previous viewings, what I believed to be the replicant give away was the way its pupils reflected off of indirect light. A reddish hue? In the Final Cut, Rachel’s eyes don’t have that give away. They’re just natural color.
Overall, I thorougly enjoyed the movie again. Having not seen it in 70mm during its initial run does not give me proper reference to compare the ‘experience.’ Knowing that the FX were shot in 65mm does give credence that the 70mm cut would be superior though. The audience enjoyed the presentation, too, as applause went up as the credits rolled. It was interesting to hear discussion of the movie by patrons filing out. As I mentioned in a previous post, it would have been great to have a moderated discussion by a production person with the movie, or even a local movie critic, or maybe even a well spoken cinephile on this film. As we exited the theater, the ushers thanked everyone for coming, to which I thanked them for a great time at the movies.
I agree with celboy that the movie could not look any better than the Ziegfeld presentation and the sound level was fine Monday night.
I can’t say this is my favorite version of the film though, as I am a big fan of the original and think the voice over complimented the noir feel and fashions perfectly.
Still, it is not as destructive as the extended version of APOCALYPSE NOW and well worth the effort.
Maybe that will encourage Warner Bros. to bring it out in fly-over land.
Today’s Variety reported the top 10 theater engagements for last weekend. The “Blade Runner” engagement at the Ziegfeld came in seventh, with a gross of $55,455.
Hey Bill… I guess I was so excited about the $2 discout coupon that I didn’t take better notice of your posting the schedule!
I am very much looking forward to making it back to the Ziegfeld (at the right time!) and finally taking in the show. I only hope that the curtain is part of that show!
Craig? You out there? Any thoughts on our suggestions here that proper volume levels and curtain shows be made a mandatory part of every Ziegfeld presentation?
I went and saw it Friday night and I think it was one of the best motion picture experiences I’ve ever had. I found it just one small step below a 70mm presentation. The movie could not look any better.
I do plan to see it again before it goes.
That weekday schedule was in place on Clearview’s website even before the movie opened. I posted it here on Oct. 4th:
Tickets are $11 for adults, $7.50 for seniors and children. “Blade Runner” shows are at 1 PM, 4 PM, 7 PM and 10 PM Friday thru Sunday, and 2 PM, 5:30 PM and 8:30 PM Monday thru Thursday.
Ed, was this schedule change announced anywhere? If they change times without proper notice in papers and online, they should offer passes or at least concession coupons to those who show up and get disappointed. I am always pissed off at wasting a trip to a cinema because of their last-minute changes. I once waited about 20 minutes in line at a boxoffice, only to find they had been sold out for over an hour. When I got the manager and asked why there was no sign put up in the window, she actually walked me in for free.
I went to the Ziegfeld this afternoon to catch the 1pm show, only to find that as of today, the weekday schedule has been modified to three showings (2PM, 5:30 and 8:30). Unfortunately, my schedule today didn’t permit me to wait for the 2pm show, so I’ll have to come back another day. There was one other person waiting outside the box office (which was closed with a sign indicating “We’ll be back at 1:30”). Looking ahead at the schedule, seems that Friday – Sunday will remain on a four-a-day schedule (1, 4, 7 and 10pm).