Radio City Music Hall
1260 6th Avenue,
New York,
NY
10020
1260 6th Avenue,
New York,
NY
10020
118 people
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I would have loved to have worked with/for Ben. Is he still around?
Regarding 70mm installations, while I was working in Hawaii
(1972-1982)I pleaded with management to make better use of the five 70mm theatres, They bauked about things like shipping costs of the large film cans to the islands, and did not want to pay the premium projectionist pay, many of them felt the audience does not know the difference. I was relentless however, and bugged the hell out of them. Finally when I was appointed chief projectionist, one of my jobs was to upgrade the projection booths in all of the theatres.
I got my hands on a 70mm reel of “Fame” and invited the bosses to the Cinerama for a demonstration of what I had planned for the theatres. I did not tell them they were going to see a 70mm film. When it was over, the CEO said it was the best thing he had seen and heard in quite a while, “are all the theatres going to look and sound like that” he asked, yes I said, as soon as you begin importing more 70mm prints. I had convinced them, and 70mm prints finally began arriving, at one point in early 1980s we had three prints playing at the same time. We had started installing Dolby in just about all the theatres by the time I left, we did not have Dolby in time for “E.T.”, however Universal struck a 70mm six track mag print without the Dolby encode just for us to play at the Waikiki #1. As for some of the management guys, like they say in the South Pacific song, “They have to be taught”.
Thank you RE for an excellent post.
It seems that Molly Brown was one of the Hall’s biggest hits of the decade. The summer of ‘64 had the Worlds Fair and this was a Debbie Reynolds musical after all. Time magazine(not Variety!) as well reported that the film had 21,000 visitors a day. Too bad about the 70mm print.
There were several reasons for Ben’s being able to veto 70mm. Most 70mm releases in those days were road shows that were too long to fit into the Music Hall policy of a stage show and movie. They had never done a show with pre-show music, intermission, entr'acte music and exit music until we did a 70mm retrospective in 1974. It wasn’t until “Molly Brown” that there was a 70mm film that was short enough to fit the policy. Ben was friends with the head of post production at MGM who told him that there weren’t going to be many 70mm releases coming up, so Ben was able to convince management that it wasn’t economically advisable to install the equipment, although at one point in time Norelco supposedly offered to give the Hall three machines for the publicity. They did consider it. I had in my files (and may have at home now) a proposal for a 70mm sound system from Ampex, complete with drawings of how it would fit in the booth. Another possible reason was that Music Hall management was more stage than film oriented (and still is). For good reason they trusted their department heads who were regarded as experts in their fields. Ben and Charlie Muller before him were expected to manage a large crew and see that the show never went down. Thus the caution about new technology. When Charlie needed technical expertise he could rely on the studio’s technical departments to supply it. Ben ran 70mm at the World’s Fair in ‘64, and understood an installation of the magnitude necessary at the Hall would very possibly interrupt the presentation, since at that time they couldn’t shut down during the installation time to work out the bugs as many theatres did. As I mentioned above there were a whole bunch of unusual problems associated with the installation that were still there when I came in as Head Projectionist in '74. I actually had a crew member try to choke me (in jest) when he heard we were going to run 70mm, and say, “We don’t want to run 70mm at the Hall.” Ben even hated the color of the ElectroSound system that was installed and which was a copy of the Ampex system originally discussed, and retired about three years after the conversion.
By the way, regarding “Molly Brown”, I mentioned to the head of post at MGM during a tour of the studio (the same one who told Ben there weren’t going to be many more 70mm releases) that I had seen the film in 70mm in Chicago. He said that they were unsure about striking any 70mm prints until they made one with a full stereo mix with surrounds and ran it for an audience. He said it was like they were watching a completly different film. Remember, most people only saw it in Scope and with a mono track. It may not be one of the great musicals, but seen on a big screen with full stereo, it has its moments.
I'mmmmmmmmmmmm going to let Rob Endres field that one.
I will say that management respected and trusted experts like Ben to guide them in matters pertaining to projection. How was that Rob,
am I a diplomat or what. I should have been a business agent.
Speaking of Molly Brown. There was this weekend on a Broadway chat line a discussion of that film and the consensus is that everyone hates it. From what I’ve seen on TV I would have to agree but seeing it in 70mm at the Hall. That would be tremendous.
Now how could this guy Ben have so much clout at the Hall as to nix 70mm there. I would have thought that most people would have been overjoyed to see a 70mm musical there including the president of the place and Leonidoff et al.
Wouldn’t the president(maybe Gould?) say to him “you figure out the logistics just make it work!”
Rob, I will be scraching my head over this one for a while. I remember being told in the early 70s, by other 306 operators, that RCMH had converted to xenon, obviously that was not the case. I also remember NO ONE challenged Ben. I can’t believe they tried that crazy half frame projection, I remember Universal trying to save costs on raw stock by reducing a six reel movie to three reels, talk about disturbing the booth operation. Let’s see, if the reel is heads up you have reel one and when it’s tails it’s reel 3. Yeah… what could possibly go wrong there? Thank God that died a quick death, I have a six inch sample to show my grand children. By the way were you aware that when the operators struck two new carbons you could hear, in the third mezz, the neg and pos carbons kissing in the 180 amp lamps? What a sweet sound that was. Thanks for all the technical info, I love to continue to learn. As for the 7,000 watt xenons I’ll look forward to seeing that, but I would not want to be in the booth if one of those explodes. The audience members will think the operator shot himself. For those of you who are unaware, sometimes a xenon bulb explodes inside the lamphouse, there is no danger to anyone but it makes a terrific bang.
Oops! Should have done my proof-reading more carefully! The sound delay from the SCREEN to the back row of the 3rd Mezz. is four frames. If the sound is in sync at the screen its four frames out of sync in the back row. Advancing the track two frames puts the sound in sync in the middle of the orchestra and at the front of the 1st Mezz. where the VIPs sit for premieres.
Vito, the HyCans were getting so dull, you might have seen one of them and thought it was xenon. I doubt that they would have experimented during Ben’s regime as he didn’t like anything that could disturb the booth operation (although they did try Universal’s half frame projection in which the reel was run from head to tail, and then taken out of the lower magazine and threaded back in the upper magazine with the other picture so there was no rewinding).
Inerestingly enough, when we started looking at xenon none of the major manufacturers wanted to give us a lamp to because of the angle and screen size. Finally, Al Bodouris of Eprad gave us a lamp to try. Once he broke the ice, Christie and ORC also installed lamps (in the case of ORC both their prototype console with vertical bulbs pointing into a 45 degree mirror, which we picked to counteract the angle), and horizontal lamps. Strong never did get involved. The light output with new collector mirrors and dichroic mirrors and new bulbs did equal the HyCans which did give a pure light, but were inefficient compared even to reflector carbon arc lamps. At 4500 watts for xenon we equalled or bettered the HyCans which ran at 100 volts at the generator and 180 amps or 18,000 watts. We didn’t change to save electricity but rather because we just couldn’t get parts for the arc lamps. We still needed to get lighter prints for premieres as we had with the carbon lamps, and we still got prints made with the soundtrack advanced two frames to count for the delay from the booth to the back row of the third mezzanine which is four frames. Now with 7,000 watt xenons in use in the 70mm projection in the Christmas Show they should really have a nice looking picture.
Ok Rob, I am sure you are right, however I left for Hawaii in 1972 and did not return to NY until 1982. I could have sworn I saw xenon projection at RCMH prior to 1972, I remember thinking the light was dull by comparison to the carbon arc, although the focus had improved. This is an eye opener for me and it has left me a bit confused. Oh, and thanks Vincent for bringing this whole thing up, just another reminder of my old mind turning to mush, lol.
“Airport” was the first film shown in 70mm at Radio City. My predecessor, Ben Olevsky, was against installing 70mm (perhaps because he knew it would disrupt a smooth running booth). MGM had wanted to do “Unsinkable Molly Brown” there in 70, but Ben was able to veto the idea. (A shame, since I saw it in Chicago in 70mm and it was a good transfer with a great sound mix.) Ross Hunter insisted that “Airport” be shown in 70, and since Universal was four-walling the Hall, Ben had no choice. The three projectors were commandered from the Paramount complex in the Gulf and Western Building at Columbus Circle, since there were three going into the theatre and four more into the two screening rooms upstairs, which weren’t ready to open. There are many stories to be told about that installation. The machines for a variety of reasons didn’t work well, and when I started there, we took them out to National Theatre Supply (Simplex) in Paramus and had them rebuilt.
I might quibble with Vito about the xenon installation. We couldn’t get condensers for the Hall & Connely carbon arc lamps. We even tried to get the used Ashcrafts from the Astor Theatre, and couldn’t do that. In 1974 we started experimenting with xenon, and at one point had a different lamp on each projector. We finally settled on ORC lamps, with vertical lamps for the 35/70 machines and horizontal lamps for the 1 and 5 machine, which had to remain on Simplex bases so they could be readily moved for use in film effect projection in the stage shows. We did get more light out of the xenons than we were getting out of the HyCans (in all fairness, that was in part due to the burned lenses in the lamps.) Focus did improve with the xenons although we had to change to slower Scope back-up lenses to compensate for the higher lamp speed. Scope focus was dramatically improved over the HyCans with the 4" Bausch and Lomb lenses that were being used.
By the way, we did run “Becky Sharp” in the first Art Deco Film Festival in 1974 and it was indeed beautiful.
Vincent I will ask my friend Rob Endres to verify this, but I believe it was with the Easter 1970 showing of “Airport”, when RCMH installed the three 35/70 projectors. That would have been projectors #2-#3-#4. Perhaps Rob can tell us if the other two straight 35mm projectors, #1 and #5 get converted to xenon at the same time.
As for your comment about Becky, “you got that right”
Vito when was the switch. For what film?
By the way Becky Sharp was restored a number of years ago except for the finale scene of which the elements no longer existed. It must be seen on a screen. Not TV!
Yes warren, it was in fact the first film to be shot in the three strip Techniclor process. Audiences, having only experienced two strip color,were blown away by the spectacular life like images.
In my humble opinion, with all of the advancements in color photography we have today, nothing compares to the splender of
three strip Techniclor print projected with a carbon arc lamp.
I remember when RCMH converted to Xenon lamps, the result in my opinion was dramatic, and not in a good way. Carbon arc is gone as is three strip, Progress? I say Humbug!
So if you didn’t have a reverent bone in your body what did you think of Leonidoff’s Glory of Easter?
I don’t have one either but I loved it(like his Nativity.)
By the way Saul Chaplin said that the film studio pulled the budget at a crucial moment in the Merry Andrew’s production leaving Kidd forced to wrap up the film with still so much to be done compromising what might have been a terrific movie.
True, “Indiscreet” is exactly the sort of film that TCM lionizes. Life is short and art is long and there’s so much to see, but if the chance comes along, I might peek at it again. Both Grant and Bergman were then a lot younger than I am now, so maybe their ages won’t seem so distracting this time.
Here’s a Program from April, 1959:
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“Merry Andrew†also seemed a minor effort, despite the talent of Michael Kidd, Johnny Mercer, IAL Diamond, Baccaloni, and others associated with it. But it was a RCMH Easter show, and Danny Kaye seemed practically a member of the family (though I never met him), and my high school friends were ready for a good laugh (which hardly came with this picture), so we went to it on Good Friday afternoon while the rest of NYC bowed hushed in prayer. That was a good thing about the Easter show at RCMH: if you didn’t have a reverent bone in your body, you could always walk in on that day without encountering a line. On the other hand, look at what happened to President Lincoln when he went to Ford’s Theater on Good Friday nearly a century earlier.
I’m surprised that Indiscreet isn’t one of those films that’s shown to death on TCM.
Maybe BOB you might want to give it another chance. It is very slight but it’s a very charming classy Donen film with a lot of style.
We’ve got older stars today doing comedy and with nowhere near the class and comic timing of Bergman and Grant.
Here’s a Program from July 1958:
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“Indiscreet†struck me as a dud projecting the exhaustion of a H’wood studio system intent on making its stars of a decade or two earlier perform as though they were younger again. I stand second to none in my admiration for Bergman, ever since at the age of three I saw her twice in “Bells of St. Mary’s,†first at RCMH and then at the RKO Dyker. And if I could only come across like Cary Grant (I try, believe me, I still try). But I remember when seeing the film at that time I thought, “This is what it must have been like at RCMH ten or fifteen years ago.†Only it wasn’t, of course.
One Showplace Program I regret having lost or misplaced around that time was for “Cat on a Hot Tin Roof†the following September. Last 22 August, Myrtleave posted a newspaper ad for that film and stage show, and I’m grateful for it. My senior year in high school had just begun, and to celebrate it, a bunch of us piled onto the subway and headed for W 50 Street. The film had its daring moments, to be sure, and also its sexy and its tender ones. I remember that when the great contour curtain descended, we engaged in a lively debate about whether Brick was really an, um, you know, shhing one another so that our frank conversation would not scandalize the tourists and families who sat all around us. It’s a kick to think that little more than a dozen years later Robert Wagner, Natalie Wood, and Laurence Olivier would perform in a prime-time television version (I never saw it) based more closely on the play’s uncensored script (or so I’ve heard). It’s also a kick to imagine that today any high school kids might shh one another on any topic whatsoever. And yet films at RCMH allegedly went out of style for lack of suitable GP product.
I was told recenly by one of the top theater organists that the american Theater Organ Society was working on some kind of event for this summer. He said the plans fell through, but that they are still working on something for the near future. Is there any new information on this?
DeanS
I was told recenly by one of the top theater organists that the american Theater Organ Society was working on some kind of event for this summer. He said the plans fell through, but that they are still working on something for the near future. Is there any new information on this?
DeanS
I think Carol Lawerence took over for Ginger after she left. Another very fond memory is when Red Skelton Appeared at the Hall He also met with the pages, and was one of the sweetest people i’ve ever met, in fact he called my girlfriend a dear heart, and you could not get the smile off her face
I also remember Ginger Rogers at Radio City. As I recall, she was a guest star in the show for a 2 week period during the 90 minute summer show that the Music Hall ran during the tourist season from Memorial Day thru Labor Day. Nearing 70 at the time, Ginger managed quite well with slow dance numbers with chorus boys doing most of the faster dancing around her. Somewhere in my archives, I have some Super 8mm footage that I shot during her numbers. All in all I have positive memories of the show although I do not recall what songs Ginger performed.
I used to look forwarded to those summer spectaculars, which were reasonably priced and reminiscent of the stage shows of previous times. Too bad they were discontinued.
Warren I don’t recall her doing any numbers from “Mame” I do rember being a very nice Lday who took the time to meet with the pages.It did run for 90 min.
Now BOB that’s enough. Leave such comments to the Roxy or Paramount page. What would the women in hats and gloves in the first mezz at the latest Greer Garson movie say?
Vincent—
O yes, the show offered that familiar underwater effect with the Corps de Ballet performing behind a scrim, onto which were projected moving images of waves (with music by Debussy, “La mer”), climaxed by Santa’s arrival that turned the ocean floor into a Christmas village (“Christmas-tide” indeed). No bubbles from any broken wind that I know of.
BOB other than the Rockette do you remember anything else about the stage show? That Santa of the Sea finale seems somewhat bizarre. I know that the Kirby flying ballet was often used for the Undersea Ballet. So was the ballet underwater and did they manage to submerge Santa as well? What I would give for films or even photos of some of these stage shows!