Ed, I’ve heard before about “plans” to renovate (or restore at this point) Loew’S Kings, however, it never actually happens and the Kings just keeps getting worse. This last “plan” just sounds like a big swindle of city tax dollars.
You got me. Besides the two theatres you’ve mentioned, I’m not aware of any theatres still running movies and haven’t been at least butchered.
The “real” movie palaces were built between 1928 and 1932. Most of the theatres built from 1913-1927 were not built specifically to run movies and for the most part, were not as opulent as the theatres built between ‘28 and '32, which included “the wonder theatres”. Fortunately, a few wonder theatres were saved, but as churches and don’t run movies.
That sounds about right to me. Here in New York, not only are there NO THEATRES (not even less than movie palace variety) at all in that category, they’ve actually torn down virtually all of them.
You can check this out on Facebook – https://www.facebook.com/groups/220242754654213/
397285866949900/#!/groups/220242754654213/
This is a theatre that I once worked in. I ran “The Godfather” there when it came out. This is VERY sad.
They have NO RESPECT for any movie palaces here in New York. Not that they’re running movies anymore, but, they even wanted to tear down Radio City Music Hall a few years back. The so called “landmarks commission here is totally corrupt.
Saps – That’s what I was thinking.-lol Where did that come from? Having run that film, in which different parts were run on assorted multiple days, I don’t think I ever want to see it again….let alone a low res version on You Tube. Besides, based on the times above, it sounds like a really condensed version.
If you came to the Alpine often, there’s a good chance we bumped into each other.-LOL
If you look at the entire city, there aren’t many theatres left and the ones that are left are mostly LARGE multiplexs. There’s a group on Facebook “trying” to save the old RKO Keith’s in Flushing from being turned into an apartment building. While the entire building was given landmark status in the 80’s after it closed, it was recinded and only the lobby now retains landmark status. However, the first owner wrecked the landmarked lobby before they stopped him. Now, after sitting all these years, the inside of this REAL movie palace is in ruins. To “restore” it to its original condition would be a job that makes me shudder.
saps- I did the design and installation of the Alpine when it was converted to 7 theatres in 1986 and was my last theatre installation. I also worked there as a projectionist until 1997. Within a couple of years (or less), ALL THEATRES will have to convert to digital projection. Because it’s so expensive, independent theatres, like the Alpine, might wind up having to close. The way things have been going with home theatres, DVD and Blu-ray release dates, etc., sadly, I don’t see a very bright future for theatres in general. I think the film companies might see that they shot themselves in the foot with all their current policies. While they helped the big theatre chains with digital conversions, the independents didn’t fare so well.
Michael Kaplan-I’ve worked as a projectionist at ALL the theatres you’ve mentioned. I used to eat at the Dragon Seed all the time. You didn’t mention the Jackson and Colony theatres on 82nd ST. I was at the Jackson after it was renovated by Skouras in 1965. It was the nicest single in the area….until it was turned into a triplex.
They intend to restore this great movie palace. I only wish I could live to see it. In the early 1950’s, its spendor could match ANY theatre in NYC. Of course also in Queens, Loews Valencia came pretty damn close.
Anyway (it took me long enough), getting back to the Trump. The entire introduction is wrong. The Trump Cinema was opened in 1968 with Zeiss Ikon 16mm projectors as a prototype for its owner, Automated Theatres of America. They, like Jerry Lewis, sold “turn key” theatre packages. The main difference between them and Jerry Lewis theatres is that ATA franchises were all equipped with Zeiss Ikon 16mm projectors and NOT 35mm.
Obviously, there wasn’t room for ONE theatre franchise company, let alone two and sometime in 1970 they sold the theatre to Ted Morse, whose brother in-law managed the theatre. Realizing they couldn’t get many current pictures in 16mm, I installed 35mm projection equipment for them in 1971. The “red” automation “start” button referred to was NEVER used from day one and I disconnected it when I installed the 35mm projectors, but it remained on the wall of the box office. They had union projectionists from the day the theatre opened, until the day it closed, which I believe was some time around 1977. In addition, it was nowhere near the site of the old Tuxedo Theatre.
The LAST thing this poor theatre ran was 16mm porno and was operated by a guy named Archie Diskin. The organ had been ripped out, but, the white console was still sitting up front below the stage.
The last time I was there was to run a TV fight in 1970 between Muhammad Ali and Jerry Quarry. It ended so fast they lit the seats on fire and tried to throw them at the screen.
I worked in this theatre a couple of times in the 60’s and can say, without reservation, I’m glad it’s closed. This theatre and about 5 or 6 others in Brooklyn were a disgrace to the word “theatre”.
jinchelsea- The Rialto, down the street from the Albemarle was operated by Century. I don’t recall the Albemarle ever being operated by Century. I believe the last owner was Interbourgh Theatres. The Albemarle had a booth built into the loge, which would have been perfect for 70mm…but it was not to be.
LOL- Al, when I saw this post it made me think about “The Ten Commandments” when Charlton Heston is on the mountain and he says “Who should I tell them sent me?” And you hear a voice that says “I am that I am….you can tell them I AM sent you.”
Al, To be honest, I really never noticed or even thought about “who” comprised the customers at the Alpine. If there was any trouble at the Alpine, I was TOTALLY unaware of it. Since I would regularly speak to some of the security people (who as you know were all off duty cops), they never mentioned any problems downstairs. I’m really surprised and saddened to hear that any Alpine employees had any problems with the local police. I would have thought that if any employees had any problems with local police, the security cops could straighten it out for them (of course it depends on the type of problem). Unlike other theatres where local police would “hide out” in the balcony in cold weather, I never saw any local police even come into the Alpine. I just assumed that with all the off duty cops that were hired as “security”, there was never any reason for local police to be around.
As you know, I stopped working at the Alpine in 1996, so I wouldn’t have been aware of anything that might have taken place after that time and would have been unaware of anything that took place at the Fortway after I stopped doing service for GTM in 1988. However, from your description, it doesn’t sound good and I’m sorry to hear about it. It’s something that I really wish I didn’t hear about.
“DJM78 on January 7, 2012 at 11:55 pm
Just read an article about the Alpine. It seems that as of a few years ago Jeffrey Deneroff still owned the building which is the Alpine.”
That could be, I haven’t kept up with it. I know that Nick Nicolaou was leasing the Alpine from Golden after Loews Cineplex (or whatever they were calling themselves at that point) gave up the theatre. He still there as far as I know. I wonder if he’s converted to DCI….or how many theatres has he converted?
Al, While you know that I agree that Bernie Goldberg was an a-hole (by the same token, Garth Drabinsky and Steve Wiener (who personally I liked), were no bargains either.
What’s all this “There was no such intentional preference against the Alpine. The Fortway just had access to an ethnic audience that Bay Ridge police intimidated at the Alpine. Blacks and hispanics were simply not welcome in the streets of Bay Ridge in the evenings, even as late as the late nineties, so movies with wide appeal went to the Fortway first” all about?
I must have missed all that shit. All I know is that EVERY TIME I had to do work at the Fortway, if I parked in the back, when I came out my window was smashed and my radio gone.
It’s hard to say, but, a VERY OLD man (I know his name but just can’t think of it now) owned the Fortway building. He MUST be dead now and it probably has to do with his family and estate and NOT anything to do with Golden Theatre Management.
As I’m sure you’re aware that theatres in general haven’t been doing very well, with the exception of the VERY large multiplexes. Within a couple of years the film companies won’t be making FILM prints any longer and if the theatre hasn’t converted to digital projection (DCI Cinema), which runs an average of $75-80,000.00, you can’t even run digital. It has already caused MANY small mom & pop theatres across the country to close down because they can’t afford the cost of converting. Yet, without that expense, the theatres would have had no problem staying in business. SAD, BUT TRUE.
The balcony at the Oceana, while steeper than the Fortway, wasn’t that steep. The Olympia theatre had a balcony that was so steep you were practically looking at your feet when you looked out the window from the projection booth. The Oceana was another theatre that, like the Fortway, was first tripled and then quaded and then two additional theatres were added back stage for a total of 6.
The two partners of Golden Theatre Management, Bernard Goldberg and Jeffrey Deneroff, essentially sold all the viable theatres to Cineplex Odeon in 1989. They continued to own some of the buildings. Last year Mr. Goldberg passed away, but Mr. Deneroff is alive and well.
Techman, you might be very pleased to learn that there are very legitimate plans that have been announced by the Brooklyn Borough President – at long last – to restore the Loew’s Kings to its former glory and put it to good use as a performing arts venue. The project is set to begin in earnest sometime next year and will hopefully be completed by 2014.“
Ed, I think that was a swindle from the start. I even sent an op/ed letter to the Times when it was announced that they were going to spend 70 million dollars to restore Loews Kings. It seems that 65 million was to come from BANKRUPT NEW YORK CITY and 5 million from the “developer”. I told them to give me only 15 million and I would do the same thing. It’s just another Bloomberg swindle. The city has owned the property for at least the last 25 years and leased it to the Flatbush Development Corp. for $1. a year. The theatre was IN PERFECT SHAPE when Flatbush took it over. They did NOTHING but let it sit and get destroyed and vandalized and NOW want to WASTE 65 million dollars. GIVE ME A BREAK!
It’s okay, you didn’t get to pick too much.-LOL
When it comes to ALL the theatres that were operated by Golden Theatre Management, I know more than I’d like to remember. Despite becoming senile, I still can’t get some of them out of my head. Some of the other theatres that I installed and/or serviced for GTM were:
The Beverly Theatre
The Granada Theatre
The Oceana Theatre
The Rugby Theatre
The Graham Theatre (Gerritsen Beach)
The Olympia Theatre (Originally Loews Olympia, Manhattan)
The Benson Theatre
The Alpine Theatre
The Fortway Theatre
Quad Cinema (13th St, Manhattan)
as well as many other theatres of Loews and RKO that I can’t even remember anymore. The only thing you can be pretty sure of is that they’re ALL GONE NOW. New York had more first class theatres than ANY OTHER city in America and with just a few exceptions, they’ve torn them all down. You would have thought that they MIGHT HAVE saved a couple of real nice Loews Theatres to run repertory films in as a non-profit operation, but NO. In Jamaica, Loews Valencia (one of the original Wonder Theatres) is still there….but it’s “The Tabernacle Of Prayer” now and doesn’t (and can’t) run movies.
DJM78-While I was still working at the Alpine (until I retired in 1996) I stopped doing any installations and service in 1988. I did all the service installations for Golden Theatre Management from 1972 until 1988. In 1989 Cineplex Odeon took over the operation of the Alpine.
I’m the “engineer” that the security cop who worked for Golden referred to. The engineer that worked for Loews told them they couldn’t make more than a Quad out of the Alpine and even that design was severely flawed as far as I was concerned. That was the main reason the theatre was sold to Golden.
Apparently, the “original” Alpine design called for a small balcony. At some point they must have decided to remove the balcony from the design, however, they kept the unusually high rear section of the theatre where the projection booth was located. The design that Loews' engineer’s came up with called for elevating a new projection booth ON TOP OF the old booth, while continuing to use the old booth and projecting OVER THE CEILING of the two rear theatres that would be created. All they were going to do was run a new wall half way down the middle of the existing twin’s width. It was at that time that I was asked “can anything better be done?” After studying the original blueprints for a couple of weeks, I worked out a design for 10 theatres of more or less equal size with a unique stepped elevation running from the original stage to the rear of the theatre. In the end, the design wound up being only 7 theatres so they could have the 2 larger theatres on one side, instead of my original 5 and 5 design. The new design required a double “T” shaped booth instead of a straight in-line stepped booth.
As for the Fortway, although my memory is gone, I’m pretty certain that the last two side theatres were done before 1982, probably 1979 or 1980. I would guess the security cop you spoke to was either John, a BIG TALL guy, or Dave, a guy with gray or white hair and thick glasses.
Ed, I’ve heard before about “plans” to renovate (or restore at this point) Loew’S Kings, however, it never actually happens and the Kings just keeps getting worse. This last “plan” just sounds like a big swindle of city tax dollars.
bigjoe59,
You got me. Besides the two theatres you’ve mentioned, I’m not aware of any theatres still running movies and haven’t been at least butchered.
The “real” movie palaces were built between 1928 and 1932. Most of the theatres built from 1913-1927 were not built specifically to run movies and for the most part, were not as opulent as the theatres built between ‘28 and '32, which included “the wonder theatres”. Fortunately, a few wonder theatres were saved, but as churches and don’t run movies.
That sounds about right to me. Here in New York, not only are there NO THEATRES (not even less than movie palace variety) at all in that category, they’ve actually torn down virtually all of them.
You can check this out on Facebook – https://www.facebook.com/groups/220242754654213/ 397285866949900/#!/groups/220242754654213/
This is a theatre that I once worked in. I ran “The Godfather” there when it came out. This is VERY sad.
They have NO RESPECT for any movie palaces here in New York. Not that they’re running movies anymore, but, they even wanted to tear down Radio City Music Hall a few years back. The so called “landmarks commission here is totally corrupt.
Saps – That’s what I was thinking.-lol Where did that come from? Having run that film, in which different parts were run on assorted multiple days, I don’t think I ever want to see it again….let alone a low res version on You Tube. Besides, based on the times above, it sounds like a really condensed version.
If you came to the Alpine often, there’s a good chance we bumped into each other.-LOL
If you look at the entire city, there aren’t many theatres left and the ones that are left are mostly LARGE multiplexs. There’s a group on Facebook “trying” to save the old RKO Keith’s in Flushing from being turned into an apartment building. While the entire building was given landmark status in the 80’s after it closed, it was recinded and only the lobby now retains landmark status. However, the first owner wrecked the landmarked lobby before they stopped him. Now, after sitting all these years, the inside of this REAL movie palace is in ruins. To “restore” it to its original condition would be a job that makes me shudder.
saps- I did the design and installation of the Alpine when it was converted to 7 theatres in 1986 and was my last theatre installation. I also worked there as a projectionist until 1997. Within a couple of years (or less), ALL THEATRES will have to convert to digital projection. Because it’s so expensive, independent theatres, like the Alpine, might wind up having to close. The way things have been going with home theatres, DVD and Blu-ray release dates, etc., sadly, I don’t see a very bright future for theatres in general. I think the film companies might see that they shot themselves in the foot with all their current policies. While they helped the big theatre chains with digital conversions, the independents didn’t fare so well.
Michael Kaplan-I’ve worked as a projectionist at ALL the theatres you’ve mentioned. I used to eat at the Dragon Seed all the time. You didn’t mention the Jackson and Colony theatres on 82nd ST. I was at the Jackson after it was renovated by Skouras in 1965. It was the nicest single in the area….until it was turned into a triplex.
Must have been a beautiful theatre in its day. It’s sad to think something so beautiful is just gone.
This picture brings back many memories. I’m sure the former owner, Harold Gussin, would probably cry seeing it.
lfreimauer – Maybe you should check out this page on
Facebook https://www.facebook.com/groups/220242754654213/223364514342037/
They intend to restore this great movie palace. I only wish I could live to see it. In the early 1950’s, its spendor could match ANY theatre in NYC. Of course also in Queens, Loews Valencia came pretty damn close.
Anyway (it took me long enough), getting back to the Trump. The entire introduction is wrong. The Trump Cinema was opened in 1968 with Zeiss Ikon 16mm projectors as a prototype for its owner, Automated Theatres of America. They, like Jerry Lewis, sold “turn key” theatre packages. The main difference between them and Jerry Lewis theatres is that ATA franchises were all equipped with Zeiss Ikon 16mm projectors and NOT 35mm.
Obviously, there wasn’t room for ONE theatre franchise company, let alone two and sometime in 1970 they sold the theatre to Ted Morse, whose brother in-law managed the theatre. Realizing they couldn’t get many current pictures in 16mm, I installed 35mm projection equipment for them in 1971. The “red” automation “start” button referred to was NEVER used from day one and I disconnected it when I installed the 35mm projectors, but it remained on the wall of the box office. They had union projectionists from the day the theatre opened, until the day it closed, which I believe was some time around 1977. In addition, it was nowhere near the site of the old Tuxedo Theatre.
The LAST thing this poor theatre ran was 16mm porno and was operated by a guy named Archie Diskin. The organ had been ripped out, but, the white console was still sitting up front below the stage.
The last time I was there was to run a TV fight in 1970 between Muhammad Ali and Jerry Quarry. It ended so fast they lit the seats on fire and tried to throw them at the screen.
I worked in this theatre a couple of times in the 60’s and can say, without reservation, I’m glad it’s closed. This theatre and about 5 or 6 others in Brooklyn were a disgrace to the word “theatre”.
jinchelsea- The Rialto, down the street from the Albemarle was operated by Century. I don’t recall the Albemarle ever being operated by Century. I believe the last owner was Interbourgh Theatres. The Albemarle had a booth built into the loge, which would have been perfect for 70mm…but it was not to be.
R.I.P.
Popeye used to say “I ams what I am and that’s all thats I am….I’m Popeye the Sailor Man”-toot toot.
“AlAlvarez on January 8, 2012 at 1:59pm
I am."
LOL- Al, when I saw this post it made me think about “The Ten Commandments” when Charlton Heston is on the mountain and he says “Who should I tell them sent me?” And you hear a voice that says “I am that I am….you can tell them I AM sent you.”
Al, To be honest, I really never noticed or even thought about “who” comprised the customers at the Alpine. If there was any trouble at the Alpine, I was TOTALLY unaware of it. Since I would regularly speak to some of the security people (who as you know were all off duty cops), they never mentioned any problems downstairs. I’m really surprised and saddened to hear that any Alpine employees had any problems with the local police. I would have thought that if any employees had any problems with local police, the security cops could straighten it out for them (of course it depends on the type of problem). Unlike other theatres where local police would “hide out” in the balcony in cold weather, I never saw any local police even come into the Alpine. I just assumed that with all the off duty cops that were hired as “security”, there was never any reason for local police to be around.
As you know, I stopped working at the Alpine in 1996, so I wouldn’t have been aware of anything that might have taken place after that time and would have been unaware of anything that took place at the Fortway after I stopped doing service for GTM in 1988. However, from your description, it doesn’t sound good and I’m sorry to hear about it. It’s something that I really wish I didn’t hear about.
In any event, have a HAPPY and HEALTHY NEW YEAR.
“DJM78 on January 7, 2012 at 11:55 pm Just read an article about the Alpine. It seems that as of a few years ago Jeffrey Deneroff still owned the building which is the Alpine.”
That could be, I haven’t kept up with it. I know that Nick Nicolaou was leasing the Alpine from Golden after Loews Cineplex (or whatever they were calling themselves at that point) gave up the theatre. He still there as far as I know. I wonder if he’s converted to DCI….or how many theatres has he converted?
Al, While you know that I agree that Bernie Goldberg was an a-hole (by the same token, Garth Drabinsky and Steve Wiener (who personally I liked), were no bargains either.
What’s all this “There was no such intentional preference against the Alpine. The Fortway just had access to an ethnic audience that Bay Ridge police intimidated at the Alpine. Blacks and hispanics were simply not welcome in the streets of Bay Ridge in the evenings, even as late as the late nineties, so movies with wide appeal went to the Fortway first” all about?
I must have missed all that shit. All I know is that EVERY TIME I had to do work at the Fortway, if I parked in the back, when I came out my window was smashed and my radio gone.
It’s hard to say, but, a VERY OLD man (I know his name but just can’t think of it now) owned the Fortway building. He MUST be dead now and it probably has to do with his family and estate and NOT anything to do with Golden Theatre Management.
As I’m sure you’re aware that theatres in general haven’t been doing very well, with the exception of the VERY large multiplexes. Within a couple of years the film companies won’t be making FILM prints any longer and if the theatre hasn’t converted to digital projection (DCI Cinema), which runs an average of $75-80,000.00, you can’t even run digital. It has already caused MANY small mom & pop theatres across the country to close down because they can’t afford the cost of converting. Yet, without that expense, the theatres would have had no problem staying in business. SAD, BUT TRUE.
The balcony at the Oceana, while steeper than the Fortway, wasn’t that steep. The Olympia theatre had a balcony that was so steep you were practically looking at your feet when you looked out the window from the projection booth. The Oceana was another theatre that, like the Fortway, was first tripled and then quaded and then two additional theatres were added back stage for a total of 6. The two partners of Golden Theatre Management, Bernard Goldberg and Jeffrey Deneroff, essentially sold all the viable theatres to Cineplex Odeon in 1989. They continued to own some of the buildings. Last year Mr. Goldberg passed away, but Mr. Deneroff is alive and well.
“From Ed Solero on March 28, 2011
Techman, you might be very pleased to learn that there are very legitimate plans that have been announced by the Brooklyn Borough President – at long last – to restore the Loew’s Kings to its former glory and put it to good use as a performing arts venue. The project is set to begin in earnest sometime next year and will hopefully be completed by 2014.“
Ed, I think that was a swindle from the start. I even sent an op/ed letter to the Times when it was announced that they were going to spend 70 million dollars to restore Loews Kings. It seems that 65 million was to come from BANKRUPT NEW YORK CITY and 5 million from the “developer”. I told them to give me only 15 million and I would do the same thing. It’s just another Bloomberg swindle. The city has owned the property for at least the last 25 years and leased it to the Flatbush Development Corp. for $1. a year. The theatre was IN PERFECT SHAPE when Flatbush took it over. They did NOTHING but let it sit and get destroyed and vandalized and NOW want to WASTE 65 million dollars. GIVE ME A BREAK!
It’s okay, you didn’t get to pick too much.-LOL When it comes to ALL the theatres that were operated by Golden Theatre Management, I know more than I’d like to remember. Despite becoming senile, I still can’t get some of them out of my head. Some of the other theatres that I installed and/or serviced for GTM were:
The Beverly Theatre The Granada Theatre The Oceana Theatre The Rugby Theatre The Graham Theatre (Gerritsen Beach) The Olympia Theatre (Originally Loews Olympia, Manhattan) The Benson Theatre The Alpine Theatre The Fortway Theatre Quad Cinema (13th St, Manhattan)
as well as many other theatres of Loews and RKO that I can’t even remember anymore. The only thing you can be pretty sure of is that they’re ALL GONE NOW. New York had more first class theatres than ANY OTHER city in America and with just a few exceptions, they’ve torn them all down. You would have thought that they MIGHT HAVE saved a couple of real nice Loews Theatres to run repertory films in as a non-profit operation, but NO. In Jamaica, Loews Valencia (one of the original Wonder Theatres) is still there….but it’s “The Tabernacle Of Prayer” now and doesn’t (and can’t) run movies.
DJM78-While I was still working at the Alpine (until I retired in 1996) I stopped doing any installations and service in 1988. I did all the service installations for Golden Theatre Management from 1972 until 1988. In 1989 Cineplex Odeon took over the operation of the Alpine.
I’m the “engineer” that the security cop who worked for Golden referred to. The engineer that worked for Loews told them they couldn’t make more than a Quad out of the Alpine and even that design was severely flawed as far as I was concerned. That was the main reason the theatre was sold to Golden.
Apparently, the “original” Alpine design called for a small balcony. At some point they must have decided to remove the balcony from the design, however, they kept the unusually high rear section of the theatre where the projection booth was located. The design that Loews' engineer’s came up with called for elevating a new projection booth ON TOP OF the old booth, while continuing to use the old booth and projecting OVER THE CEILING of the two rear theatres that would be created. All they were going to do was run a new wall half way down the middle of the existing twin’s width. It was at that time that I was asked “can anything better be done?” After studying the original blueprints for a couple of weeks, I worked out a design for 10 theatres of more or less equal size with a unique stepped elevation running from the original stage to the rear of the theatre. In the end, the design wound up being only 7 theatres so they could have the 2 larger theatres on one side, instead of my original 5 and 5 design. The new design required a double “T” shaped booth instead of a straight in-line stepped booth.
As for the Fortway, although my memory is gone, I’m pretty certain that the last two side theatres were done before 1982, probably 1979 or 1980. I would guess the security cop you spoke to was either John, a BIG TALL guy, or Dave, a guy with gray or white hair and thick glasses.