Ziegfeld Theatre

Thanks guys, I am an old school man who will never conform to the new school way of thinking when it comes to film presentation.

Jeff, the curtain(s) usually are a part of the automation, along with lights and all the rest. Some one would have to explain what type of automation the Ziegfeld has, perhaps it is a simple basic system that works the functions of only the projection system. I have seen automations that only start shows and work the lights. It would seem to me odd that the Ziegfeld would not have an automation system that would also work the curtains. I ran a booth with a fully loaded automation system which was capable of running different functions on a clock with a cam that would enable the start of each function to start independently. It is simply a matter of programming the automation on the first day of a new show to meet the requirements of that particular movie. It is possible to push a button which would dim the house lights and then after a beat start the projector and lamp, open the curtain and dim the stage lights.
Some automation systems can be programmed to make a lens change via a turret and open/close masking.
But again, at the Ziegfeld where you still have a projectionist in the booth all day; it would b a simple matter for him/her to
“put on a show” manually.
It baffles me why they don’t always do that.

I meant remnants of my self editing, that I do several times before posting. Thus a repeated phrase like “It was explained to me by a top pro to me” Obviously typing and brevity aren’t my strong suits! Not an expert here, just a well informed enthusiast.

Howard, could it be that your camera and experience would produce better shots?

And IS it really that dark in there?

Interesting, William. It would be fun to interview you as well as Mr Endres. I’ve asked at some venues if the curtain can be operated manually if necessary, and if not, shouldn’t it be set up this way for that same reason? I can remember watching the pre-feature cartoons on the second curtain way back when I was a kid. I imagine that’s probably what happened, and someone ran back to open them manually.

I think that is one reason why theatres don’t want curtains… in those cases I’d suggest they make the side masking wide enough to close over the screen.

l wish I could go back and correct typos & editing remnants!

Hi again, gentlemen. I am glad HBH took so many pictures. Sad however because it looks like the auditorium is not being fully lit anymore. Don’t know why people do this. Used to be only the dingy older places kept lights low so you won’t see the dirt. However the Pantages in LA, even after a big renovation, keeps the lights too low to even read your Playbill, and the recently freshened up Mann Westwood Village keeps the walk-in lights at nearly show level… too dark to even see the theatre… The clue that it’s too dark in the Zieg is that in the mezzanine several spots are really dark.

About digital sound: As a VIP tour guide at Paramount, I often worked the employee screenings in their big theatre, and made friends with the projectonist. A Seasoned pro named Ron England (sp?) We talked presentation and tech all the time. I often took my tours in there for a little “Projection 101.” I’d hold up a piece of film, show each of the soundtracks and explain how they worked…

Then came the big explanation to “why movies are so loud.” It was explained to me by a top pro to me: the film is mixed that way. Huh? I elaborated for my tours that it was akin to vinal records and CDs… Old vinyl was mastered with a limited range of volume, so you could put on a record, and once you set the volume, be pretty sure it would all play at about that level. Digital, having a much broader range of volume, means one of your CDs may be louder than the others, and one song can be louder than others on the same disc. Now Digital FILM soundtracks have an even broader range, from a pin drop to a deafening speaker blowout.

Why are trailers so loud? for the same reason TV commercials are. Most TV programming is mixed to play at a mid level, saving the top volume range for effects. Commercials are mixed to play at the higher level throughout, because they figure you’re probably out of the room… Film trailers want to get your attention over the popcorn crunching and settling in of the crowd.

Why are FEATURES so loud? OK, remembering that going back to the old rock and roll days, when they started making things so loud your ears literally can’t fully hear the full fidelity, people began turning things up much louder than they need to be. Try falling asleep to the TV. You can keep turning down the volume and still be attuned to the dialogue. These days, extreme bass has become popular, as the kids want to FEEL it instead of just listening to it. That’s why we have bass enhancement on nearly every playback device, and why living in an apartment near these people is a bitch. They hear their music, but bass travels farther, and the neighbors FEEL a dull repetitive thumping.

Bringing this mentality to films has been happening for a while, and we now have what some like to call the “Bruckheimer Mix” – where the soundtrack is mixed with all the dialogue at the lowest level, and the loud violence, car chases, explosions, etc are all at the top of the range. This gives the projectionist 3 choices: 1) to make the explosions less alarming, turn down the volume below 5 and the audience has to read the actor’s lips. 2) turn it above 5 for the extremists and blow out all your speakers. 3) play it right at 5, as the director intended, so the dialogue is normal and the rest is, well, often Too Damn Loud.

Regarding digital projection: Automated film projection requires only a small piece of silver mylar tape on the film, to trigger the curtains, lights, and even the preshow music. I’m sure the pros here will attest that these can be cued individually or in a certain sequence. Can’t the advanced technology of Digital Cinema be programmed for this as well?

Could it be that the days the curtain and sound aren’t handled as well are a different projectionist less attuned to showmanship? or was there no operator in the booth for those shows at all? It’s not uncommon for a projectionist to come in, set up, than leave, because he is required to handle several theatres.

Vito, your right once it’s set with the right volume setting and the system is loaded and ready to show. Running curtains and lights only takes a few seconds out of a two hour movie.

“The Booth According to Vito” Coming Soon to a Theatre near you!

I am confused. Some days the curtains are used and the sound is fine, other days no curtains and low sound.
Why can’t management find a level that works well to enhance the presentation of the movie. And leave it there?
Should the sound be loud?, of course it should.
Should curtains be used at every performance? of course they should.

Going back to when we first started using stereo sound in theatres we had some patrons who wanted it played lower, I can still see the ole folks running out of the theatre shaking their hearing aid and holding their ears. Well too bad!
I would never allow a couple of people to ruin the experience for all the others, a simple sorry, out of respect for the film maker we have chosen that level of sound and we would rather not change it. Then a pass/refund and be gone with them.

As to the curtains, MarkNYLA wrote maybe the projectionists were too busy to run curtains. The fact is with a Digital presentation all the guy has to do in the first show, and the first show only, is log on to the computer, select the feature, or platter as it is called, and set the timer.
That’s all he has to do the entire day!
Only a second movie or a problem would require the projectionist to go to the computer again. So running curtains and lights, manually if necesary, should be easy to do. I don’t undertand the mind set of a projectionist working the Ziegfeld who would not want to put on a first class show. They need to leave the multiplex mentality at the door.
Now I understand different Digital projection systems work differently, but basically the fact remains that the projectionist has little nothing to do once the inital setup is done in the first show. Anyone disagree? I would love to be enlightened if I am wrong.
Come on Clearview, get this nonsense under control.
DON’T MAKE ME COME UP THERE! :))

The curtains were used Saturday, but not Friday, not Sunday. The sound was apparently loud enough Saturday but not Friday, not Sunday. Special requests are honored, at least for 10 PM Sunday…..

I was determined to travel from Philly to attend Saturday until Movieguy’s assertion of sound so low he got refunded & no curtain. Well, I saw Blade Runner at the Uptown (Washington DC) screen a decade ago, with a larger curved screen, a great sound system though 35 mm print. This isn’t likely a better experience, just a few changes made to the film. I will live if I don’t get to it.

Now, Clearview, audience members have remarked online how wonderful your film presentations have been, that in the Northeast, along with National Amusements, you are setting the standards. Please use an appropriately loud enough film presentation always! Refund the few people who think the “film is too loud.” And, the Ziegfeld being a flagship cinema that people attend because they want a REAL movie theater experience, please use those curtains before the movie begins! We live with the Preshow (and that is better than slides), but before the previews and/or feature, let’s please use the curtains.

For HOWARD and BILL:
Was in the neighborhood and tried BLADE RUNNER again 10PM Sunday.
I got there just as the previous show broke – I asked some people about what they thought of the volume level. Surprisingly, a few said that they had trouble understanding some of the conversations and/or that it was “muffled” Oh oh…
Spoke with a manager beforehand – she assured me that the projectionist would raise the volume for me. And he did! What a difference it was! Good show.
There were, again, maybe 300 people there.
No use of the curtains though.

BOBT , true ,true the presentation is perfect..I CANT SEE ANYONE NOT LOVING THE PRESENTATION!

Blade Runner The Final Cut on Ziegfeld marquee, lit at night:
View link

Exterior Sept 24, 2007 photo of premiere at Ziegfeld of “Michael Clayton” with George Clooney present,
View link

I think people who’d complain about the volume being too loud should just stay out of the Ziegfeld. A place like that was built to play stuff loud. I’m reminded of last year’s showing of “Doctor Zhivago”: a thrillingly loud, powerful first half, then, after someone in the audience complained, a pleasant volume like Movieguy described, but one which almost drained all the life out of the movie. “Zhivago” should never be played at a lower volume than the last time you played it at home on DVD, not at the Ziegfeld.

Really, there isn’t a whole lot of difference between this and the last so-called Director’s Cut. Some scenes are shorter, some are extended (Tyrell and Pris’s death scenes are longer and a little bloodier), a little bit of new footage is in the nightclub scene. Some continuity errors and mistakes have been cleaned up, many others left in. The crane cables lifting up the flying police cars have been erased, and everybody knows about the newly shot footage with Joanna Cassidy to fix her death scene. Batty’s death scene with the dove flying away has been reshot as well. No narration. Ridley Scott gave an interview to Wired Magazine in which he confirmed that Dekkard is absolutely a replicant, which still doesn’t make a lick of sense given what happens in the movie. Oh well.

It looked great though. I understand all the effects plates were rescanned at 8K resolution and recomposited. It’s amazing how much well photographed miniatures can look so much more convincing than CGI cartoons. Whether or not it’s all worth another pop for the DVD, well, that’s up to you. I’m not a bit convinced that this will really be the last version of this title.